Athiest and any scientist on here please explain to me how the universe matter time and space came to be and how life on Earth began?

Question

This should be fun and interesting ^-^
I'll give you a hint ..

The first origins of life that is before life according to evolution theory and thermodynamics is that we started off as a primordial soup of nothing but chemicals the basic elements on Earth

Then from there you need certain amount of enthalpy ,heat ,entropy Gibbs free energy ,work and force , in order to have chemical reactions and you need particles to collide at a certain specific orientation to create new chemical compounds
Then from there you can get a DNA and RNA nucleic acid with the nitrogenous base rings and then from there you get protein transcription which transcribes all the stuff you need to get a cell to replicate organs systems structure form to get a living organism animal these all require specific mechanisms

I've taken you guys that far
Now I want you to explain to me where does the driving forces for all these chemical thermodynamic reactions come from and how do we achieve such specific orientation collisions in order to get all of this
How did such specific mechanism for creating life and allowing life living organism to function biologically come from

And then I want you to explain to me where these basic elements that is matter came from and where time and space came from

If you think your so smart and intelligent please explain to me a poor religious god believing fundie who you deem uneducated and unintelligent :( help me understand

Answer 1

The universe was sneezed out of the nose of the great green arkelsiezure.

Answer 2

How and when the universe began (and whether it is finite, infinite) is a cosmology question that no one can answer. Not even Einstein had an answer and no one currently living has an answer to that question. Many people now think that there was a Big Bang (I don't buy the Big Bang BS by the way) but even the strongest supporters of the Big Bang theory cannot tell us what existed before the Big Bang, and why there was a Big Bang. They simply claim, by observing the red shift in the frequency of light from distant galaxies that they seem to be moving away from us. If everything is moving apart, then if we turn the clock back far enough, everything must have been found in the same place. That entire theory is based on the assumption that the observed red shift is due to motion. What if there is another reason why the red shift existed, and that everything in the universe is not actually flying apart? What if light loses energy as it travels so that by the time it made its way to us the wavelength of that light has become longer, i.e. red shifted? What if the background radiation is actually the result of all those light waves that have become so "tired" after such long travels that they are everywhere since they came from everywhere else? These are questions that may need to be answered by scientists of the future.



If the red shift was not due to motion, then there probably wasn't a Big Bang. Besides, no one has ever shown us a force that is big enough to result in all the matter in the entire known universe to fly apart. In fact, there is no force that can cause a black hole to explode, and the biggest black hole of them all would have been the entire universe being found in a single location prior to the Big Bang. Worse, in the current state of knowledge, there is evidence that the universe is supposedly expanding even faster than was predicted by the Big Bang Theory. To explain this data, they now claim that there is such thing as dark matter and dark energy, which are responsible for the faster expansion of the universe. To me, that is unacceptable BS (an ad hoc explanation invented to try to save a disproven theory) since no one has ever found any dark matter or even know what it is. All they found is new data that can only be explained if dark matter exists. That is not good enough for me.



As to how life began on earth, that is less of a mystery. Scientific experiments have shown that under the conditions thought to be similar to that of the early earth, organic molecules would have been synthesized naturally. That means the early earth was filled with a lot of different organic chemicals and a lot of it. There was nothing around to consume these chemicals, and by chance, something joined together and resulted in the first living organisms that could consume those chemicals to grow and reproduce. Nevertheless, no one has yet conducted an experiment that show us how that could have happened. However, the evidence that life evolved from inorganic substances is a whole lot stronger than the evidence for the so-called Big Bang.

Answer 3

Peptides, nucleic acids, amino acids are all found in comets and can be detected spectorally on other space objects. The appear to be common and are a natural product of the chemical reactions that occur initially in stars. Thus, the building blocks of like are abundant, given that carbon, phosphorous, sulfur, nitrogen are abundant.



Self replication and organisation occurs amongst molecules in non-living and living compounds. See it in crystals and sifting sands on a beach.



All the elements for life occur everywhere, requiring only the addition of liquid water, salts, correct temperature range and radiation to instigate life.



Having said that, The Theory of Evolution does not consider this step in the origin of life. Evolution considers how life changes.



No gods are required for any of this to occur.

Answer 4

There is no evolutionary theory of the origin of life.



There may be chemical hypotheses, some of which do not require proteins or nucleic acids in the first possibilities. Some are based on the common observation of the spontaneous formation of micelles, which are fatty globules suspended in water. The inclusion of ionic or other substances in micelles is thermodynamically favoured. I see you have opened a chemistry textbook to the thermodynamics section. Look a bit further for micelles and maybe liposomes, but that's likely to be under organic chemistry and in a more advanced book.



Despite the constant attempts of the inhabitants of Religion and Spirituality, their pastors and assorted parasites like Ken Ham to define biological evolution as something that it is not for the purpose of creating a straw man argument, the definition used by biologists remains " Biological evolution is any change in the frequency of alleles in a population of organisms." Two of those who attempt to redefine biological evolution have already answered and one has favoured us with an image that is nothing more than ignorance pretending to be educated opinion. The other is no more than a troll and dishonest at that.



You may note that the definition I have quoted, versions of which may be found in any genuine biology textbook, applies to existing populations, not individuals and has left open the question of the origin of life.



The definition predates the formation of organisations like the Institute for Creation Research by twenty years or more but I see time and time again that such institutions deliberately ignore it. There are two possible reasons for that, stupidity or deliberate dishonesty. Given the record of every staff member from Henry Morris to whomever joined last week, I'm going with deliberate dishonesty for financial gain, otherwise known as fraud.



If you genuinely wish to be updated on some hypotheses on the origin of life, look into the extensive work by David Deamer and Jack Szostak. These may fray your argument from ignorance somewhat.



EDIT Creatio ex nihilo is a religious dogma, not a scientific principle. The phrase was even used by Ken Ham and Co as the title of one of his magazines before he deserted the Creation Science Foundation to form Answers in Genesis. Yes, I know quite a lot about him, he was at the Queensland Institute of Technology at the same time I was. I even suspect that I might have met him though it may have been someone else, after all it was 40 some years ago.



Did your biochem lectures ever tell you about the orientation of chemical bonds? sp3 hybridisation and all that? Tetrahedral carbon atoms?



Yes, I expect that the physicists who put the BB theory together from about 1930 to today were entirely ignorant of thermodynamics.

Answer 5

I might, if I cared, but I don't so I won't. And you are truly not interested anyway so there's no point....

Answer 6

Science asks those same questions. Some are answered, some are yet to be answered. What science doesn't do is invoke supernatural beings to get an answer. You are making the stupid argument that because everything is not know in precise detail then what is known is wrong. That is an invalid argument.



You are also intimating at probability. Probability does funny things with very large numbers. The odds against all the grains of sand being in their current spatial relationship to every other grain of sand are incomprehensibly large, yet they are in that spatial relationship. That spacial relationship is in constant flux with each new one having the same odds against it yet that relationship still occurs.



One big error you make is implying current cosmology says the universe came from nothing. Nope. That is what the Judeo-Christian-Islamic theology says.

Another big one is saying anything about evolutionary theory saying anything about how life began. It is about how organisms change and branch over time.



Atoms order themselves all the time BTW. Even inorganic compounds that make up crystals. Ever see a iron pyrite cube? No "agency" made that beyond the nature of iron pyrite molecules. https://crystal-cure.com/pics/pyrite-cube.jpg

Answer 7

" where does the driving forces for all these chemical thermodynamic reactions come from and how do we achieve such specific orientation collisions in order to get all of this" ???

They do not come from any god. There is no "in order to get all of this". This just happen, without any intention, without any purpose, and even if there was one, it will just be "in order to destroy everything" : Our universe is condemned, it was condemned to the nanosecond where it began its expansion. There is no intelligence behind matter, or energy, no intelligence behind the laws that govern it, no intelligence in the Pi number, or behind the fact that the square of the length of the hypotenuse is equal to the sum of the squares of the lengths of the other two sides.



"Also remember that the laws of thermodynamics and Physics and even Math says you cannot create something out of nothing" but that's exactly what you say about your god: that he created himself from nothing and created the universe ex nihilo. You are completely imbued with magical thought and childish precepts where everything exists "for something". So what is the use of black holes? In your logic, what is the use of pulsars and magnets?

Answer 8

K thx bye

Answer 9

Congratulations! You've done some homework, or more likely, are cutting and pasting from somebody's website. I don't have all the answers, that's what religion claims. You understand a little. You don't understand a lot. Perhaps you should try reading further.

Answer 10

I don't know.



But I do know that positing "goddunit" is not an acceptable answer.







Update: you shouldn't have posted that update. You're now playing the "I'm so much smarter and higher and mightier than you" game. Why do you assume that some of the people answering the question aren't any smarter

and more educated than you?



The answer to the question is: we don't know. Period. That says nothing about your religious beliefs, unless you want to argue from ignorance and think it says something about a deity's existence, which is unscientific and totally stupid.



Update 2: So you've resorted to the "it's so complex, so goddunit" argument. You should go back to school because there is plenty of thought is science that things can come into existence from nothing.



Science doesn't view the universe as a "creation." If you do, you just beg the question, a logical fallacy any amateur would understand.



Please tell us which Mathematical law says: you can't create something out of nothing????

Answer 11

For such a genius, you can't Google?



"Do you have any real logical answer based on scientific evidence and facts in academia and literature" - Ask and you shall receive.



Abiogenesis - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abiogenesis#References



Big bang - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang#References



And did you really just argue chemical reactions are really improbable? Because it certainly sounds like it. And you do know RNA forms automatically given sufficient RNA bases? Did you know cell walls form automatically due to hydrophilic / hydrophobic properties? Which means some of your 'specific mechanisms' are inevitable.



Bit clue, genius. There is no live / none life distinction. Life is merely an exergonic chemical reaction, the energy releasing redox reaction that is metabolism.



As for where do natural forces come from, anything that exists has to have properties and behaviours. So they are an inherent property of existence.



As for your straw man something from nothing, that is your belief, not ours. Hint, zero energy universe. Did you really shoot your god down, or are you going to special plead your way out of it like the rest of your brethren?



And do you have any real logical answer based on scientific evidence and facts in academia and literature explaining where your god came from, and how it did all this, because at the moment, science is on our side?

Answer 12

Thermodynamic should give you a clue...thermo/heat....dynamics/movement...Sun warmed primordial soup and bacteria burst into life...voila! the beginning of life.



As to universe etc....why couldn't the circs be right for nature to construct them? You don't know from the pitifully small knowledge we have gleaned...either. That's not a criticism....Just a fact...one days maybe, billions of years from now we might have evolved enough to discover the secrets of the universe and our place in it.



Atheist

Answer 13

"I'll give you a hint" - you are not asking an honest question but setting up strawman statements.

Answer 14

Li Shaoje, Li-san, I observe throughout your long rant a theme of, "I do not know, ergo god did it". Whether someone can explain things or not, that does not automatically imply "God did it..Yu Ti did it...Amaterasu did it...ghosts did it...ETs did it, etc.! It just means we do not know. Why do you assume without basis that there must be some "driving force"? That presupposes some type of god, but science does not use gods to explain anything, and it never has needed any since it began. Preconceptions are not part of science either. Science is objective, so it must discard preconceptions. We do not know if the universe had a beginning. It could be eternal. It is more logical to think of an eternal universe that proceeds from simple to complex than to invent an infinitely complex god as the beginning and have the rest of the universe catch up to it as time passes. It is Christianity that says God created something from nothing. Creationists' flimsy straw men claim science says that, but creationists lie ruthlessly. You make some errors for someone who has a degree in science. You also need a class in Logic. Scientists have recreated some early earth conditions, and amino acids spontaneously appeared. In time, we can surely recreate more of the process of amino acids combining into proteins and proteins joining to form simple organisms. No "driving force" was needed. That refutes your unfounded assumption.

Answer 15

Why are you asking a question you clearly know the answer to, in order to shame others for their lack of intelligence and what they believe in, after bragging about your education when clearly you know nothing when it comes to empathy, compassion, and even moreso manners? Your form of bullying is disgraceful. What are you going to do when you die? With all that education that's clearly just a useless piece of paper your government uses to put you, a number, on a payroll they deem fit. Leaving you to worry about how things came to be, when you aren't even using your "intelligence" to do something better to improve our world. You just sit there bullying others with pride and snobbery. As intelligent as you are, it's disgusting you won't do something better with your life when your emotional intelligence is obviously suffering from your inflated ego and left brain antics. Intelligence doesn't define maturity, and clearly you need to rethink how you handle social interactions.

Answer 16

Can you read?

Answer 17

In other words, God went "POOF"? I think you're just a troll who knows a little science. Demonstrate that the universe could only have come about as the result of a decision.

Answer 18

Natural selection works in chemistry and physics too, life got here from biological evolution. The Earth is not a closed system, we get constant input of energy from the sun, that's the so-called driving force. Radiation from the sun was higher in the early Earth about 4 billion years ago. That's what drove energy to form compounds from the elements and eventually leading to nucleic acids. Once you have nucleic acids evolution via natural selection takes over.



The stars are responsible for creating most natural elements. Gravity and dark matter forced larger molecules together, forming atseroids, comets and planets. Water came to Earth via comets. As already explained radiation from the sun drove the formation of compounds and to self replicating DNA. This was made possible because of water. Than, evolution via natural selection.

Answer 19

Athiest and any scientist on here please explain to me how the universe matter time and space came to be and how life on Earth began?



- Typical brain dead fundie, trying to have 3 PhD's worth of information in 25 words or less, since that is the limit of their intelligence.



The first origins of life that is before life according to evolution theory



- And the idiot proves it. Evolution has nothing to do with the origins of life.



and thermodynamics



- WOW, big word for a fundie, and as he continues to prove, he has absolutely no idea what it is or how to apply it.



is that we started off as a primordial soup of nothing but chemicals the basic elements on Earth



- And a dozen experiments from 1956 to the present have proven that, it is a good place to start.



I've taken you guys that far Now I want you to explain to me where does the driving forces for all these chemical thermodynamic reactions come from



- E-N-E-R-G-Y. Chemical, physical thermal forces. Some of the stuff you will learn in high school science, when you get there.



how do we achieve such specific orientation collisions in order to get all of this



- That is like asking - how does gravity know which way is down, and once again, the idiot fundie proves it.



And then I want you to explain to me where these basic elements that is matter came from



- Basic chemistry, again, take a chemistry class when you get into high school.



If you think your so smart and intelligent please explain to me a poor religious god believing fundie who you deem uneducated and unintelligent :( help me understand



- And again you want 3 PhD's worth of information in 25 words or less. Get your own education.



FYI i have my BSc in both Biochemistry and Computer Sciences double major

i studied Calculus , Physics, Biology, cell biology , evolutionary biology, neurobiology, General and Organic Chemistry, thermodynamics, Biochemistry,



- If you actually studied those, then you have lied about everything you have said so far, so chances are you are lying about having any kind of education. Evolution has nothing to do with origins of life, any idiot who got beyond junior high knows that.



Keep in mind that different proteins have different confirmations and different chemical compounds also have different configurations



- Your point?



Explain how the atoms for the compound got in such a specific orientation.



- CHEMICAL REACTIONS, just like sulfur reacts with water other chemicals react with other chemicals. Like I said, take a chemistry class when you get into high school.



Also remember that the laws of thermodynamics and Physics and even Math says you cannot create something out of nothing



- And now join the 21st century, "nothing" does not exist.



but even that requires the driving forces of thermodynamic physics



- Yes, heat and pressure over came gravity and the atomic forces. See what you can learn in high school.



but that doesn't' answer my question



- You don't actually have a question, you just spew absurdities.



i want you explain where those driving thermodynamic forces to cause such events came from



- Heat and pressure over came gravity and the atomic forces, and then expanded. Energy turned into photons, then sub atomic particles then atoms and eventually molecules. See what high school can do for you.

Answer 20

Ask a cosmologist, not a non existing Athiest.

Answer 21

Like this: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2000483/Sparks-mirrors-Quantum-scientists-make-nothing.html



and like this: https://www.wired.com/2009/05/ribonucleotides/



Life then macro-evolved into multicellular creatures like this: https://www.wired.com/2012/01/evolution-of-multicellularity/





But these are not the reasons why we don't believe in the fabricated superstitions called gods. If anything, the above list of discoveries only substantiates what we have already realized.



Oh and before I forget.......how does having a BSc in both Biochemistry and Computer Sciences disprove the fact that gods are man-made superstitions invented by ancient shepherds who believed that an eclipse was caused by bad behavior?



Now don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that christians and muslims have low IQ. (My cardio is a muslim and he is one of the best in the state). Economists for example have a high IQ. So do musicians, accountants, lawyers, financial advisors, political advisors, meteorologists, physicists, pediatricians, dentists, architects, surgeons, computer scientists and engineers.



Atheists tend to emerge in other fields of knowledge that otherwise engages their Engines of Reason and Doubt such as anthropology, biology, philosophy and neurophysiology. But this is not required. Atheists appear in all professions from Science and Engineering to Music and even Ministry.



If you want people to take your superstitious beliefs seriously, then you're going to have to shoulder the burden of proof and demonstrate how it is a real part of our reality. Attacking Atheists for using skepticism and doubt and boasting about some PhD won't make gods any more real than Harry Potter. What you're doing is just another facet of the god-of-the-gaps argument and playing on the frontiers of ignorance - what do we NOT know and how can I blind others with this lack of knowledge....etc etc.

Answer 22

Once you've got any self replicating arrangement of matter in a resource rich environment, where chemical reactions occur in huge orders of magnitude per hour, (as they do in oceans) those arrangements of matter will very rapidly diversify.

Answer 23

You need to understand that when you go to anti-science web-pages, they are not actually telling you what science says. They are liars.

Answer 24

I just think it's funny how you parrot things you don't understand.

Answer 25

I think I'm smarter than you because I know the difference between "your" and "you're".

Answer 26

Space-time, energy, matter... I've only seen guesses involving, "quantum fluctuations" I don't understand yet. Standard big bang models don't go back that far. They start an instant after the universe started expanding.



As for life, there are a bunch of different ideas about that.Ranging from it coming from elsewhere in space to ideas like pores in clay covered by a lipid layer acting as the first cell walls for what would eventually become DNA.



there is no one singular theory for a lot of these things. And to say, "I don't know" is the most honest position until one is demonstrated.

Answer 27

The First part of your question is still theory. My opinion is that the Universe has always existed and was not created. Time is infinite. Matter, The Elements, Were created when Stars Explode.

A Star is a Gas Giant made up of Hydrogen. Nuclear Fusion of Hydrogen produces Helium Element number 2 and the Fusion process Continues creating all the Elements.

Life on Earth started in the Oceans due a chemical process which was quite by accident.

This life EVOLVED to what we have today.

Answer 28

.

Answer 29

I heard one guy explain that it all arrived "on the backs of crystals." No wonder nobody takes them seriously.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUetJ3umTWU

Answer 30

Read several books, goddammit. This is R&S, not Intro to Everything.



Math: Zero = -1 + 1



The total energy in the universe is thought to be very close to zero. The universe is a fancy rearrangement of nothing.

Answer 31

I will give you another hint, there is a science & mathematics section! If you really wanted scientist to answer, that would be the section. I have no idea how everything began or if anything you said was relevant. Scientist might give you a dozen different answer but mine is I haven't the foggiest!

Answer 32

Ah, we don't have all of the answers yet, but we are getting there.



BTW, where did your god come from?

Answer 33

TIRH NOT ABOUT THEM OR SCIENCE...GOD SPOKE TO MAKE ALL PHYSICAL THINGS AND ALL LIFE..

Answer 34

FYI- I dont believe a word about what you are supposed to have studied



and remember

"that the laws of thermodynamics and Physics and even Math says you cannot create something out of nothing"

no they dont

maths as such says absolutely nothing about it,. the maths is only used to prove the physics

If you knew the 1st thing about quantum mechanics (thats physics) you would know that it DOES say that

something can come out of "nothing"

(you can "borrow" energy then "pay it back" - i.e WE exist due to "borrowed" energy)



"but even that requires the driving forces of thermodynamic physics"

On no it dont

If you knew the 1st thing about ANY laws on thermodynamics you would know that they only applies to a closed system

there is NO naturally closed system in the universe

and we have no idea if those laws applied BEFORE the universe existed



OR IF they did (this is where it gets interesting), a closed system comprised whatever existed before the universe did AND the universe itself (the universe being created within that pre-existing existence)

(but that pre-existing existence may not have had "time" or any of the 3 dimensions we are aware of so we would regard it as "nothing")

(ie the closed system comprised (whatever existed before the universe did(and maybe still exists) + (the universe)

If THIS is the case then whats the problem? - the energy the universe "borrowed" in order to exist came from (whatever existed before the universe did, and still exists)

Perfectly ok with all the laws of thermodynamics

cos the total energy of this closed system is the same as it was before the universe existed, its just the size of this closed system has been expanded as a result of the creation of the universe in it



It gets even more interesting if that preexisting existence (ie whatever existed before the universe existed) no longer exists. Then all the negative energy that was "there" (cos our universe "borrowed" it) is now "here" in this universe and dont need to be "paid back" cos the "closed system" has shrunk to this universe only

That is

all the energy in our universe came from something we regard as "nothing" but had an existence before our universe did . but when our universe came into existence that "nothing" ceased to have any form of existence and became truly "nothing"

So the laws on thermodynamics STILL have not been violated



(If you WERE educated as you claim then this should all be clear to you,

but since I am damned sure you dont understand it ................the conclusion is obvious)



lastly

YOU believe whatever you want

YOU claim whatever qualifications or education you like

I dont give a sh//t (and I dont believe you either)



But the big bang + evolution+abiogenesis sure beat the sh//t out of



"the universe and life were created by a supernatural entity existing nowhere from nothing using magic"

Answer 35

After every mass extinction new critters entered the fossil record. Either 'God' simply created these new critters, or they 'evolved' from what ever gene pool remained. Of course these extinctions didn't happen all in a day, but rather over millions of years...and we know that from the fossil record. We also know that the first living thing to survive was blue-green alge ...after that there was an explosion of life...a billion years later there were people...at least five different species. From alge to people....No god required.

Answer 36

I've read all the previous answers and your comments. I, too, would like to ask, respectfully, why, if you have the academic ability to know about all those difficult subjects, you do not have the academic ability to spell simple words that you should know given how much and how long you must have gone to university for to amass all that knowledge. I agree with a few of the other answers that you are not really interested in anything but denigrating atheists (if you actually wanted a scientist to see this, you would have put it in the appropriate science section) and being nasty and rude. Shame on you!

Answer 37

your brain is way too retarded to understand. you stick to your iron age sky creature

Answer 38

When you ask "Athiest (strange, with your supposed string of academic achievements you can't spell atheist correctly) and any scientist on here please explain to me how the universe matter time and space (and you cannot even punctuate correctly) came to be and how life on Earth began", it would be even MORE interesting how you would explain how your mythical biblical god came into existence.



But even more interesting, see my answer here showing that the Bible itself proves that its god does not exist.



https://answersrip.com/question/index?qid=20160126064750AAyTwxr



In any case, with all your supposed academic achievements you still post your arrogant questions just like a typical ignorant, lay creationist does.



But the point is that an admission that we do not know, and probably will never know, everything, but that by hard work and investigating and analyzing the natural world around us that can at least learn SOME things is a heck of a lot better than being intellectually lazy and mindlessly believing that some mythical god provides all the answers we need when, in fact, it provides no answers at all and actually leads down the dark path of false belief derived from ancient myth, e.g., creationism.

Answer 39

I suspect that matter has always existed. There's a lot I don't know but I don't fill in the gaps in my knowledge with magic and imaginary sky daddies. That's for dimwitted believers.

Answer 40

You failed to notice that our world has a huge amount of energy in many forms--heat, electricity, radiation--to create life from the available chemicals on our planet over hundreds of millions of years. You need a remedial course in biology.

Answer 41

This is two entirely different topics. One a matter of cosmology, one a matter of chemistry. I guess you could be forgiven for this error of conflation if you were really interested in getting some sort of scientifically grounded answer.



I suspect though, given that you've posted this to R&S instead of the relevant science sections that what you're really after is some smug high-fives from your fundie buddies and a lot of non-scientists struggling to find some useful google links which you've no intention of ever clicking on.