Jehovah's Witnesses, your translation: Please explain Col. 2:9?

2012-02-12 21:14:06 UTC

Greetings

Every verse used in support of the Trinity must be ripped out of its context and requires an ignorance of biblical grammar, word definitions and usage.

The Trinitarian interpretation of Col. 2:9 is no different. "For it is in him that all the fullness (PLHRWMA) of God's nature lives embodied, and in union with him you too are filled with it."--Goodspeed's (see ASV, NRSV).

Trinitarians claim that when the KJV reads "in him dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily" it means that Jesus was equal to Almighty God or was literally "God in the flesh." Is this correct? We need to determine the meaning of the Greek words here. We also need to consider the context of the scripture.

First, verse 10 states that Christians "share in this fullness in him" (NAB). Also Paul says of Christians "That ye might be filled with all the fullness of God" (Eph.3:19; cf. Jn. 1:14,16).

No one would claim that because Paul said Christians would be "filled with all the fullness of God" then we must be equal to God. Likewise, it is ridiculous to claim that this would make Jesus equal to God. The obvious understanding is that Christians and Christ would be full of God's divine qualities, certainly not some mystical union of a Trinitarian "Godhead."

The scholar A. Richardson says: "Taken by themselves, these two sentences might be theological statements about the essential nature of Christ...But in both places Paul goes on to speak of what God has done for Christians through Christ..So he seems to be thinking chiefly of the fullness of divine grace which is in Christ, and by him is made available for men...all Christians are filled with all the fullness of god (Eph. 3:19), i.e. with the fullness which has its source in God, not the fullness which God has in himself."—A Theological Wordbook of the Bible; 89

"These passages most clearly evince that Christ has received his fullness from God, in the sense in which we shall receive our fullness from Christ. It is of no weight in proving that Christ is of the same essence with God." —John Milton, On Christian Doctrine.

The context confirms this since Col. 1:19 says all fullness dwells in him, then 2:3 speaks of "wisdom and knowledge" concealed in him and 2:10 says Christians would share in this fullness do some degree. So the context is talking about qualities not equality. Compare Eph. 3:19 and Jn. 1:14,16,17; 14:9.

Next, the Greek word translated "divine quality" or "Godhead," is 'THEOTETOS.' Trinitarians insist that this means "absolute deity" or "the state of being fully God." Yet, standard lexicons state that this is not necessarily the case: According to the BAGD Lexicon it means "divine nature, deity, divinity" (pg. 358).

Almost all Lexicons state that this word was used of divinity or a divine nature/quality, not just "absolute Deity." In fact, "THEOTETOS," is an "abstract noun" (see B.A.D.G.) and so it must be a quality! Jesus most certainly does possess all the fullness of divine quality and Christians share in those qualities as God's representatives (Jn 3:34).

If Jesus really were Almighty God then this fullness of the divine quality would be intrinsic to his very being. Yet, Col. 1:19 explicitly states that this "fullness" was Christ's because God "saw good" (EUDOKESEN), or it "pleased the Father" (KJV) for this to be so.

Christ *received* his fullness (of qualities) from God, in the same sense that we must receive our fullness from Christ. If Christ were equal to Almighty God he would not need someone else to agree or consent to his having all the fullness of the divine quality! As usual, Christ had to be *granted* the power to carry out the divine purpose (Mat. 28:18). It wasn't his by nature.

Context shows that Paul could not have meant that Jesus was The God, or equal to Almighty God. In addition to Jesus not having this "divine fulness" inherently but only by God's choice (1:19), Paul also taught that Jesus had a God over him (Col.1:3; Eph.1:3), that he was the son of God (1:13) and as such was only the "image" of God (1:15 cf. "representation" Heb.1:3). Also the use of "EN" and "DIA" with the genitive in Col. 1:14-17 shows that Jesus was the instrument used by God in creation not the Creator. Paul taught that Jesus was not God himself, but the mediator between God and men (2Ti.2:5) and that he was at the "right hand of God" (3:1). None of this could be predicated of one who was in fact Almighty God!

In the larger context, your interpretation would cause a blatant contradiction. In the flesh Jesus was less than God (Jn.14:28), he was lower than angels (Heb.2:7,9). Therefore he cannot be also equal to God in Col.1.

Touted by some as the strongest evidence for Jesus being God, we find it is quite flimsy. This verse is not saying Christ is God."

Yours,

BAR-ANERGES

2016-11-01 07:38:19 UTC

Col Translation

2014-09-20 10:07:34 UTC

In Colossians 2:9, it is written that "in Him dwells all the fullness of deity bodily" ( NASB).

The word " deity" here is "theotetos" in Greek.

Thayer ( a Unitarian himself) defines te Greek word 'theotetos' as " the state of being God."

In Latin Vulgate, theotetos is translated as DEITAS ( deity) and not DIVINITAS ( divinity).

The immediate context of the verse tells us that we are complete in Christ ( v.9) that is why we should look onto Him and not onto the traditions of men and the vain philosophy of men (v. 7).

Colossians 1:19 says that " it pleased that all the fullness should dwell." The phrase ' the Father' is not in any Greek MSS amd based on its context, it is not about the identity of Jesus as God but rather, as the head of the church.

Colossians 2:9 is very clear that the Messiah is God in the flesh.

fixerken

2012-02-13 09:22:56 UTC

At Colossians 2:9 the apostle Paul says that in Christ “all the fullness of the divine quality [form of the·o′tes] dwells bodily.” Here, again, some translations read “Godhead” or “deity,” which Trinitarians interpret to mean that God personally dwells in Christ. (KJ, NE, RS, NAB) However, Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon defines the·o′tes in basically the same way it does thei·o′tes, as meaning “divinity, divine nature.” (P. 792) The Syriac Peshitta and the Latin Vulgate render this word as “divinity.” Thus, here too, there is a solid basis for rendering thei·o′tes as referring to quality, not personality.

A consideration of the context of Colossians 2:9 clearly shows that having “divinity,” or “divine nature,” does not make Christ the same as God the Almighty. In the preceding chapter, Paul says: “God saw good for all fullness to dwell in him.” (Col 1:19) Thus, all fullness dwells in Christ because it “pleased the Father” (KJ, Dy), because it was “by God’s own choice.” (NE) So the fullness of “divinity” that dwells in Christ is his as a result of a decision made by the Father. Further showing that having such “fullness” does not make Christ the same person as Almighty God is the fact that Paul later speaks of Christ as being “seated at the right hand of God.”—Col 3:1.

Considering the immediate context of Colossians 2:9, it is noted that in verse 8, Christians are warned against being misled by those who advocate philosophy and human tradition. They are also told that “carefully concealed in [Christ] are all the treasures of wisdom and of knowledge,” and they are urged to “go on walking in union with him, rooted and being built up in him and being stabilized in the faith.” (Col 2:3, 6, 7) In addition, verses 13 to 15 explain that they are made alive through faith, being released from the Law covenant. Paul’s argument, therefore, is that Christians do not need the Law (which was removed by means of Christ) or human philosophy and tradition. They have all they need, a precious “fullness,” in Christ.—Col 2:10-12.

?

2012-02-10 14:49:58 UTC

KJ reads: “In him [Christ] dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead [Greek, the·o′te·tos] bodily.” (A similar thought is conveyed by the renderings in NE, RS, JB, NAB, Dy.) However, NW reads: “It is in him that all the fullness of the divine quality dwells bodily.” (AT, We, and CKW read “God’s nature,” instead of “Godhead.” Compare 2 Peter 1:4.)

Admittedly, not everyone offers the same interpretation of Colossians 2:9. But what is in agreement with the rest of the inspired letter to the Colossians? Did Christ have in himself something that is his because he is God, part of a Trinity? Or is “the fullness” that dwells in him something that became his because of the decision of someone else? Colossians 1:19 (KJ, Dy) says that all fullness dwelt in Christ because it “pleased the Father” for this to be the case. NE says it was “by God’s own choice.”

Consider the immediate context of Colossians 2:9: In verse 8, readers are warned against being misled by those who advocate philosophy and human traditions. They are also told that in Christ “are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge” and are urged to “live in him” and to be “rooted and built up in him and established in the faith.” (Verses 3, 6, 7) It is in him, and not in the originators or the teachers of human philosophy, that a certain precious “fulness” dwells. Was the apostle Paul there saying that the “fulness” that was in Christ made Christ God himself? Not according to Colossians 3:1, where Christ is said to be “seated at the right hand of God.”—See KJ, Dy, TEV, NAB.

According to Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon, the·o′tes (the nominative form, from which the·o′te·tos is derived) means “divinity, divine nature.” (Oxford, 1968, p. 792) Being truly “divinity,” or of “divine nature,” does not make Jesus as the Son of God coequal and coeternal with the Father, any more than the fact that all humans share “humanity” or “human nature” makes them coequal or all the same age.

Elijah

2012-02-12 21:39:48 UTC

The trinitarian argument that Col. 2:9 proves that Jesus is God overlooks the common understanding of "fulness of ..." and "filled with ..." by those who used those common phrases in New Testament times. For example, the person who became "filled with Holy Spirit" (Eph. 5:18) was greatly influenced by that spirit, but he certainly did not become the Holy Spirit.

And having "the fulness" of someone or something could similarly mean being greatly influenced by that person or thing. The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology says:

"Just as a person can be full of pain, joy, love, and virtue, he can also be said to be filled with God ..., i.e. possessed and inspired by God." - Vol. 1, p. 734.[4]

Surely we wouldn't expect anyone who is "filled with" God or who receives the "fulness of" God to actually be God! Nor would we expect anyone who has the "fulness of" Christ to actually be Christ! In fact it clearly shows that he is NOT the person with whom he is "filled".

Col. 2:9 is also rendered by trinitarian scholars with these translations of theotes: "The full content of divine nature" - TEV and GNB (also see Barclay); "God's nature" - AT; "Yet it is in [Christ] that God gives a full and complete expression of himself (within the physical limits that he set himself in Christ)." - Phillips; "In him resides all the fulfillment of the divine" - Lattimore.

Additional reading:

http://examiningthetrinity.blogspot.com/2009/09/fulness.html

Teller Of Truths

2012-02-10 14:55:38 UTC

At Colossians 2:9 the apostle Paul says that in Christ “all the fullness of the divine quality [form of the·o′tes] dwells bodily.” Here, again, some translations read “Godhead” or “deity,” which Trinitarians interpret to mean that God personally dwells in Christ. (KJ, NE, RS, NAB) However, Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon defines the·o′tes in basically the same way it does thei·o′tes, as meaning “divinity, divine nature.” (P. 792) The Syriac Peshitta and the Latin Vulgate render this word as “divinity.” Thus, here too, there is a solid basis for rendering thei·o′tes as referring to quality, not personality.

A consideration of the context of Colossians 2:9 clearly shows that having “divinity,” or “divine nature,” does not make Christ the same as God the Almighty. In the preceding chapter, Paul says: “God saw good for all fullness to dwell in him.” (Col 1:19) Thus, all fullness dwells in Christ because it “pleased the Father” (KJ, Dy), because it was “by God’s own choice.” (NE) So the fullness of “divinity” that dwells in Christ is his as a result of a decision made by the Father. Further showing that having such “fullness” does not make Christ the same person as Almighty God is the fact that Paul later speaks of Christ as being “seated at the right hand of God.”—Col 3:1.

Waiting For Paradise

2012-02-12 21:33:03 UTC

What Bar Anerges wrote.

Rolando C I

2012-02-10 19:56:44 UTC

Because other scriptures refute your analogy. Especially the ones where Jesus says that he has a God that rules over him. John 20:17 - Rev.3:12

troll to troll

2012-02-11 07:12:31 UTC

Godhead - QEOTHTOS - θεῖος - theios - Godhead 1. a general name of deities used by the Greeks as a corporate whole, 2. used for God Trinity; the Father, Christ/Son/Jesus, Holy Spirit

'Theios' is a singular plural in Greek as 'Elohim' is an intensive singular plural in Hebrew. This word for God is a concept from Greek which means (in part) Totality of God(s). This is like saying "congress" meaning the many members but is a singular or "staff" which can be several people but is a singular. All God as one - both Elohim and Godhead are the same a singular plural: Deuteronomy 6:4&5 4 “Hear, O Yisra’el: YHVH our Elohim, YHVH is one! 5“And you shall love YHVH your Elohim with all your heart, and with all your being, and with all your might. (link)

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Paul did not refrain from using words and terms that were familiar to the people of the area that he taught. People that were Koine Greek speaking people understood exactly what Paul meant. The Greek speaking Israelites and others of the lands in which Paul taught knew precisely what he was saying.

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And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.(Matthew 28:18) Paul confirms, For in him dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. (Colossians 2:9) Godhead - Greek, Theotes; Strong's G2320 "Theotes" is a singular plural. A pagan Greek would have used "Theotes" panoply of Gods they believed in. Being a Hebrew of Hebrews taught and trained by the finest of teachers as a rich young man Paul used this Greek word which reflects the Hebrew "Elohim". Elohim has a root meaning which includes “strength, power, might”*. The fullness of Elohim "*strength, power, might*" dwells in him bodily.

Elohim - Hebrew, plural of Eloah, Strongs H430 "Elohim" as "Theotes" is a singular plural and can be used in Biblical Hebrew for a plethora of gods by pagan peoples.

Understanding the word "Theotes" is based on the Hebrew use of "Elohim", shows that Paul is saying that all this power and authority dwells in Jesus bodily. All the power and authority is given to Jesus by the Almighty YAH. “Therefore God also highly exalted him, and gave to him the name which is above every name.” (Philippians 2:9) Jesus is not YAH the Father who exalted him. Jesus was raised in the body and has flesh and bones. Our Father is spirit. And yet the Father tells the angels to worship Him (Hebrews 1) and "He put all things in subjection under his feet.(1 Corinthians 15:27)

Deo

2012-02-10 16:53:52 UTC

Of course, JWs sometimes like to play a game with semantics... They will claim that they do believe in the divinity of Jesus... Which simply means that for them Jesus is not fully God, but fully Godlike... So they take Col 2:9 to mean that Jesus is fully Godlike... So it is not enough to ask JWs if they believe in the full divinity of Jesus... A Christian must probe JWs more to see that they use the word "divinity" differently... You can ask them, "If Jesus possesses the fullness of divinity/divine nature, then that means he possesses ALL of the attributes of God, isn't it? One of those attributes is eternality, right? So do you believe that Jesus is eternal?" At this point, it will be clear to you that JWs mean differently when they confess: "Jesus is fully divine."... They try to critique (see @GERRY's) the orthodox interpretation of Col 2:9 this way: "Each human possesses fullness of humanity, but that doesn't mean we are of the same age, right?" How does one answer such critique? First, address their false assumption by quoting God's word in Psalms 50:16, 21- 'But to the wicked God says: "These things you have done and I kept silent; you thought I was ALTOGETHER LIKE you. But I will rebuke you

and accuse you to your face.' Their analogy of humanity and divinity is wrong... While finity is an attribute of all humans (that why each of us has age), finity is not an attribute of divinity. Infinity is. God is age-less. So the JW critique is wrong, because their analogy is wrong.

@truthbearer, It will not do to argue that Jesus' possession of the fulness of divinity in Col 2:9 is only after His resurrection... In fact, before he became human, he already possessed the fullness of divinity! Says John 1:1c, "The Logos had the same nature as God". That's the best translation of Jn 1:1 according to Greek scholar Paul B. Harner. He doesn't accept the NWT's "The Word was a god" translation. To use his article, as do the JWs to support their translation of Jn 1:1, is to misquote him.

hmmm... you said: "what are you going to do with the fact that the Apostle Peter, shows that we will all be partakers of this DIVINE nature"... first, according to JW theology, its only the 144,000 who will be partakers of the divine nature, right truthBEARER? JWs interpret Peter's word "become sharers of the divine nature" to mean that the 144,000 will be "divinized".. i.e. that these people, once in Heaven will be gods as well... i hope you won't hide that fact... Peter doesn't say that we will ONTOLOGICALLY share in the divine nature, but only ETHICALLY...Note the context please:

2 Peter 1:4-7. Christians become sharers in the divine nature, not in being divinized, but by living ethically through God's power.

@rolando c: Well, Trinitarians believe there's a hierarchy among the members of the Trinity. Not hierarchy in NATURE though, for plainly, the Son is not subordinate in nature to the Father ("In Christ all fullnes of the divinity dwells bodily/The Logos has the same nature as God" - Col 2:9, Jn 1:1) We believe there can be a hierarchy in ROLE among the members of the Trinity. This distinction is what JWs fail to notice. The Son is subordinate to the Father in his role as the Messiah... In Isaiah 52/53, Christ is called "the servant of Jehovah" because of his subordinate role as Messiah, but his Person is called "the arm of Jehovah" in 53:1. (Jehovah's "arm" is not an entity separate from Jehovah, it is Jehovah himself in the exercise of his power. Please take a look at these verses for examples: Psalms 89:10, 21, 98:1 136:12, Deut 26:8 Luke 1:51) Furthermore, he is called the "man of sorrows" in 53:3... The only option to harmonize these data is by John's statement: The Logos had the same nature as God... and the Logos became a man (John 1:1, 14). That's the Incarnation... Now, distinguishing between nature and role helps us to see verses like John 20:17 in perspective - "I am returning to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God"... Take note that Jesus can simply say: "I am returning to our Father and to our God" but He did not do so simply because Jesus' relationship to God as Father is NOT IDENTICAL to our relationship to God as Father...Jesus is God's Son by nature, we are God's sons by adoption...Jesus has never used "Our Father" in relation to himself and his disciples because he doesn't want to BLUR the difference between his sonship and his diciples' sonship...Jesus' having his God and us having our God are NOT IDENTICAL too...Jesus has a God over him because he humbly accepted his Messianic role in subjection to the Father...

2012-02-10 15:56:58 UTC

I am not a JW.

The reason why it was purposely rendered by the Jehovah's Witnesses is that it must fit with their teachings of Jesus Christ being simply a god and having divine qualities of a god.

Grammar:

Page 92- Greek Grammar Beyond the Basic-Wallace

Genetive of Content: [full of, containing]

Noun genitive singular feminine: divine (theotetos)

A noun in the genitive case helps to limit the scope of another noun by indicating its "kind" or "class". It is generally translated into English with a prepositional phrase starting with the word "of".

If the word to which this genitive is related is a noun, replace the word ‘of’ with the paraphrase ‘full of’ or ‘containing’.

Knowing this, Of (FULL OF) the Diety (Godhead) bodily (tes theotetos somatikos) clearly states Jesus as Diety- (Nominal Genitive of content)

Context:

Benjamin B. Warfield, while discussing Paul’s conception of Christ, wrote:

...we are told not only that (naturally) in Him all the fulness dwells (Col. i.19), but, with complete explication, that “all the fulness of the Godhead dwells in him bodily” (Col. ii.9); that is to say, the very Deity of God, that which makes God God, in all its completeness, has its permanent home in Our Lord, and that in a “bodily fashion,” that is, it is in Him clothed with a body. He who looks upon Jesus Christ see, no doubt, a body and a man; but as he sees the man clothed with the body, so he sees God Himself, in all the fulness of His Deity, clothed with the humanity.6

There is little need to further elaborate on the obvious meaning of theotetos. Let it suffice to say that such scholars as Alford,7 Nicoll,8 and A. T. Robertson9 all view it in similar manner. Even a cursory glance at how some of the major translations render the word bear this out:

RSV: For in him the whole fulness of deity dwells bodily...

NIV: For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form...

NEB: For it is in Christ that the complete being of the Godhead dwells embodied...

Barclay: For it is in Christ that godhead in all its completeness dwells in bodily form.

Amplified: For in Him the whole fullness of Deity (the Godhead), continues to dwell in bodily form - giving complete expression of the divine nature.

http://vintage.aomin.org/theotetos.html

“As has been already alluded to, the term somatikos-bodily implies that Jesus retains his human nature forever. In order for Christ to have the fullness of Deity eternally indwelling Him bodily he must have a material body since God is Spirit. (cf. John 4:24) This implies that prior to Christ's incarnation he existed without either a material or spiritual body, and only took a material form when born of the virgin. It is this body, now glorified, that contains the fullness of Deity forever.”

Matthew 22:41-45

Revelation 22:16

Romans 9:4-5 NKJV

http://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/christology.htm

truthbearer

2012-02-10 16:14:13 UTC

Regardless of which translation anyone uses, this is totally speaking of AFTER the RESURRECTION of Jesus Christ and his ascension to heaven, where God set Jesus on the throne of god, and then called Jesus, God. Now let all the angels of God worship him.

Not before. When you all try to say that Mary's baby was fully God, you are ADDING LIES TO GOD'S WORD and it is totally false and misleading.

Then you miss the real truth, that this MAN, JESUS, earned this glory BY HIS PERFECT LIFE, overcoming sin in the FLESH of his being human just the same as us.

and what are you going to do with the fact that the Apostle Peter, shows that we will all be partakers of this DIVINE nature, when we follow Jesus as we should:

2 Peter 1:3-5

King James Version (KJV)

3According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

4Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

So now, does that me us fully God?

You do greatly err, not knowing the truth of god, but trying always to prove the catholic lie of Mary being mother of a god. It is simply not true.

the JW also missed the real truth, not having revelation from God, but still FOLLOWED THE LIE OF CATHOLICISM, OF INCARNATION, when not one single verse mentions such a thing.

So they say it is an incarnate angel. there is no such thing as any incarnate god or angle. It is lies of the devil.

Edit: write and ask me anything you wish. The answers are ALL in written Scripture, and without it, there is no truth. I was showing that just because Jesus was given all power in heaven and earth, BY GOD, AFTER HIS RESURRECTION, (thereby, having all the fullness of the Godhead) does NOT mean that he was anything other than FULLY HUMAN. If, If, he had been God, before God set Jesus on his throne, there would have been no need for God to have to GIVE POWER TO JESUS.

You have not heard these truths, because the seventh church is STILL in the lead and is blind, naked, dead, wretched, poor and cast out of God's mouth. The truth is not in them, and that is why God said, COME OUT OF HER. I came out and God is now teaching me, HIMSELF, HIS TRUTH. Jesus is MY GOD. But he is still a MAN.

Edit@doe: for one thing, I am NOT a JW. They do not have anymore truth than you do. Neither of you have any truth from God, but go with the false teachings of the lukewarm, blind church. Jesus is NOT THE WORD OF GOD. He never taught such a thing. His apostles never taught such a thing. that teaching did not exist until the catholic church changed all of God's truth and brought in the pagan, trinity, idols.

You do not know what you think you know. What you say, THEY ALL SAY. Even the JW cling to the false idea that Jesus, as some kind of being, existed before he was born. GOD NEVER SAID SUCH A THING.

It is not in any scripture. Paul never claimed this, Peter never believed it. It is lies.

The 144,000 should never be written that way, as a numeral; for it is not a numeral. It does NOT MEAN that MANY...neither does ONE MEAN 1.

the 144,000 (doing this for short), happens to be ALL OF GODS PEOPLE from the very beginning. Paul and that early church were clearly the FRIST FRUITS. We are all fruit on that tree of life. It has no number. Just as the members of the God kingdom, has no number. No one has any idea how many members are GOD. So now fire away, WRITE TO ME and bring your accusations. You have no scripture proof. only twists, adding to it, taking away from it.

Edit@watchtower: You said: Summary: Studying the greek grammar along with the context and several passages within the bible clearly state Jesus is the God-man, two natures united in one person.

Me: give me just 1 verse. It is not written in any scripture, but is lies of man. the term, God-man, does not exist in Scripture, for it is lies of the devil. You say it clearly says this...then prove it, quote me 1 verse. If they close this out, email it to me. You will see you cannot do it.

Also, quote me that word, INCARNATION, from 1 verse. find it. You will see it is not God's word. It is satan's word.

2012-02-10 14:55:39 UTC

Colossians 2:9 means Jesus is Fully God notice how it says all the fullness deity or all the fullness of divine quality. The King James says all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. It means Jesus is fully God

God was manifested in Jesus Christ

Jesus is 100% God and 100% Man

John 1:1 Jesus the Word of God was God

2 Corinithians 5:19 God was in Christ,

1 Timothy 3:16 God was manifest in the flesh,

Colossians 2:9 For in Jesus dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.

Acts 5:3-4 The Holy Spirit is God

The bible clearly teaches there is

One God in three persons

The Father, Son and Holy Spirit is God

2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV

To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

1 Timothy 3:16 KJV

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Colossians 2:9 KJV

For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1 KJV

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Acts 5:3-4 KJV

But Peter said , Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land? 4 Whiles it remained , was it not thine own ? and after it was sold , was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.

Jesus claimed to be the great I am of the old testament and Jesus said if you do not believe I am you will die in your sins.

God is I am

Deuteronomy 32:39 KJV

See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill , and I make alive ; I wound , and I heal : neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand.

Jesus claimed to be the I am

John 8:24 KJV

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

Only God can be the savior

Isaiah 43:10-11 KJV

Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen : that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed , neither shall there be after me. 11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour .

Jesus is Savior

Luke 2:11

For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

?

2012-02-10 15:15:00 UTC

Col 2:9 says all the fullness of deity lives in bodily form.

Does it say lesser or least ? NO it says all the fullness. Jesus is fully God and that's what the scripture says. The Jehovah Witnesses like to twist scripture around to their own teachings by the word of man. This is why they use that reasoning book. The scripture clearly says all the fullness of deity lives in bodily form. Jesus is fully God.

The bible is very clear that Jesus is fully God. It says all the fullness of deity not little or least or lesser.

The Jehovah Witnesses like to add on to the word of God just like you can see with that reasoning book. Its like the Holy Bible is not good enough for them so they have to keep adding on and on. Whats the matter ? Word of God not good enough for ya ? Gotta keep adding on and twisting scripture around ?

The NWT Jehovah Witness watchtower bible is full of errors and is NOT trustworthy. They created it in the 1960s to try to conform to their own teachings.

Check this website out.

http://carm.org/religious-movements/jehovahs-witnesses/bad-translations-jehovahs-witness-bible-new-world-translation

http://carm.org/is-the-jehovahs-witness-religion-christian

Jehovah Witnesses are NOT Christian ." Like all non-Christian cults, the Jehovah's Witness organization distorts the essential doctrines of Christianity. It denies the deity of Christ, His physical resurrection, and salvation by grace. This alone makes it non-Christian. To support its erring doctrines, the Watchtower organization (which is the author and teacher of all official Jehovah's Witness theology), has even altered the Bible to make it agree with its changing and non-Christian teachings. Check this website out http://carm.org/religious-movements/jehovahs-witnesses/bad-translations-jehovahs-witness-bible-new-world-translation

Typical with cults that use the Bible to support its position is a host of interpretive errors:

Taking verses out of their immediate context.

Refusing to read verses in the entire biblical context.

Inserting their theological presuppositions into the text.

Altering the Biblical text to suit their needs.

Latching onto one verse to interpret a host of others.

Changing the meanings of words.

Proclaiming some passages to be figurative when they contradict their doctrines.

Adding to the Word of God.