Does this homeschooling case frighten and upset you as much as it does me?

Question

California courts have determined that homeschooling by a parent that does not have teaching credentials is "educational neglect" and that children from 6-18 must either be enrolled in a public school, private school, or tutored at home by a credentialed teacher. What are your thoughts on this? Please state your religious view of this as well (Christians are not the only ones that homeschool their children).

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/03/07/MNJDVF0F1.DTL

Answer 1

Though this case was specifically aimed at this family that homeschooled their children, the ramifications are far exceeding to all other homeschools.

I honestly feel that this case was brought on by failures of the public schools to properly educate the students. Studies within the state of California have shown that homeshool children have scored higher in standardized tests than those of public schools. The spelling bee champion the last 7 years has been homeschooled, only 1 parent was a credentialed teacher. What does that tell you about the public school system?

The other really important issue to discuss with this ruling is: If all these students get enrolled in the public school system, where are the teachers going to come from. There is a national shortage on teachers. They are forcing a large amount of kids (167,000 I think) to enroll in public schools. That in turn will increase the teacher:student ratio and the students that need the individual help to grow, will not get it. Because of the NCLB law, these children will be passed, yet not have the education they deserve to get in public school setting. Also because of the NCLB, the school system will be forced to higher either more teachers or paraprofessionals to help with the influx of students. Thereby using more of the state budget for education, thereby raising taxes and mill levies in most of the areas, that are poor. So how does this help? It doesn't, it just an organization (NEA) trying to push their authority and it's going to backfire. The other reason I think this is happening, is there is a national shortage of teachers. California's logic in this: Why have credentialed teachers teaching students for free, when we can offer them a job to teach for money? Yet, they fail to understand why people homeschool. This court case will not answer that question.



Side Note: Due to the shortage of teachers, the state of Kansas is considering passing a law that will credential anyone with a bachelors degree and above to be a teacher. There is a national shortage of teachers and within the next decade there will be an estimated 2 million job openings for teachers.

Answer 2

The thing that set this whole thing in motion should have been confined to the one family that it pertained to and 166000 other home schooling families should not have been included in the court case. I believe that parents should have the right to home school their children as long as they are able to obtain curriculum that at least covers the basics. In most states, that is the case. Most home schoolers I know, go above and beyond teaching their children the basics. I do not believe that home school children should sleep until noon and do about an hour of work and call that an education. As a parent who currently sends my children to public school, I can say that there are days I feel like I am sending them into a den of lions or a fiery furnace. There is so much negative that they have picked up in public school and these are things I spend every weekend and evening and summer trying to weed out of them. I have not been able to afford to home school, and that is the only reason I do not right now. California made some very disturbing changes last year when it was deemed that the use of the words "father and mother and husband and wife" were a violation in public schools. If the public school system feels it has the liberty to teach unproven theories and its own form of morality then I believe it is my duty as a parent to put a stop to the molestation of my child's mind. I do not feel it is anyone's job to look down on other parents who send their children to public school or for other parents to look down on those who choose to home school. I had friends that were home schooled and tested in 7th grade in some areas on a college level. Moreover, some who went on to become lawyers, excelling in their college classes just as well if not better than a public school taught child. The truth of the matter is that home schooling is not for some. The few that are neglectful should not cause punishment for those that are very careful to insure an exceptional education for their children at home.



(I am a Christian mother who desires to home school my now public educated children)



*edit two of my children were bored to tears in their pre-k and kindergarten classes because they already knew more than what was being taught to them by the public school system and if I would have had the opportunity to continue educating them myself, they would have kept going at an accelerated pace...

Answer 3

If a person can read & comprehend what they read then they can learn & teach. You don't need a certificate to know that much.



Home education was started by liberals not the religious sects. As time went on all types of people homeschooled.



Have you researched who was home educated in their lifetime? This may enlighten you a bit.



George Washington Carver



· Pierre Curie



· Albert Einstein



· Michael Faraday - electrochemist



· Oliver Heaviside - physicist and electromagnetism researcher



· T.H. Huxley



· Blaise Pascal



· Booker T. Washington



These are the Scientists that were homeschooled.



So was George Washington & several others.

Answer 4

I know this is opening up a different side to this question but I have to tell it . MY cousin Amanda now 17 got caught up in the NO KID LEFT BEHIND law in the 6th grade. Her grades were failing and she was losing interest in school after her second year in 6th grade she just gave up on school and started not going which ended her up in JV court where she was placed on Probation.This is a kid that didn't get into trouble didn't do drugs or get into things against the law .

Well she was about to go to JV jail so her mother decided to home school her to keep her out of the system any farther.

Well Amanda took 6th grade 3 years in a row and finally made it to 7th grade by that time she was driving a car and 16 years old .In Amanda's case she fell through the cracks of the educational system she was unable to pass the required test to move to the next grade and they refused to place her in a Special Education class of give her Student support.Amanda is still Home schooling and is now in the 8th grade but she will be 18 in May and has said she will take no more schooling when her birthday comes.She is embarrased that she was stuck in the 6th grade for so long and it severely damaged her self esteem. In Amanda's case Home Schooling was definatly the right answer. He mother a High school graduate and her father an invalid on his death bed due to cronic illness had no choice for Amanda.This would not have been possible if it were a requirment of Teaching credentials. She would have had a very diffrent future in a jail for criminals instead of Homeschooling because their faimly lives on very small monthly income they could never have been able to afford to pay someone elseto teach her.

Answer 5

This is more than likely the National Education Association at work. Any trend away from Public Education disturbs them.



My understanding is that in many cases home schooled children do better than those public schools on standardized testing but I know that isn't always the case.



I would agree there should be some level of standards provided that those standards were purely academic and do not include some of the Politically Correct nonsense permeating in the public schools today(which is why so many are opting out).



I think most states require some accountability from home schools and that's fine but to ban them or require "certified tutors" sounds like more bureaucracy with no educational benefit. Knowing "progressive" California this likely will pass.

Answer 6

While in principle I believe homeschooling to be a viable option for many, I have heaps of concerns throughout my own experience in supporting a home schooling family and awareness of others who homeschool.

I would still consider it if I lived in an area where schooling was unsafe. If teachers were incompetent I would deal with that another way.

As a teacher, I considered homeschooling our family, but the issue that concerned me the most is that children need to work with others and have social interaction.

I supported a family for a while that had a teen homeschooled instead of attending highschool. I provided and oversaw the curriculum and they were inspected from time to time. However, the teen did next to nothing as her mother did not seem to be able to sit her down and take the time to work with her. Yet they were acceptable.

Another child I taught at school. His family were obsessed with his education, to the point of him having his own schoolroom where he spent hours doing work in holidays and out of hours. He just had no life left in him. They took him out of school a year or so after I had taught him. Yes I had contacted our child services, but nothing ever happens. I truly fear for him as now there is noone to balance the scales or keep an eye on his welfare beyond learning and books.

Even having a parent who is a registered teacher will not solve the issues that I have regarding homeschooling.

Answer 7

I live in B.C. Canada. I know many children who are home schooled by a parent or family member . They're thriving from the more focused attention regardless of their parents credentials.

It is disturbing that California seems to be harder on some groups and maby not so much on the ones that need more supervision. I cannot give any real examples of this but it seems to be true everywhere.

Answer 8

It's clear that schools, with all their requirements for credentials, are not producing educated children capable of making their way in the world of today. So I view this as hypocracy on the part of California. It has been shown that home-schooled children are better educated than institutionalized children.



Yes, this angers me more than frightens. It is another means for the state to take control away from parents to raise their children as they see fit.

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Answer 9

I home-schooled my kids in Florida with the only requirement that they be tested each year by an approved teacher. My kids were testing 3 and 4 years above grade level.



But then, we used the Study Technology developed by L Ron Hubbard too.



I have to ask - who taught the first teacher?

Answer 10

When you consider the fact that home schooled children do better on average than children who attend public schools on standardized tests you can see that the law is just another example of the government trying to force people into another one of it's tax payer funded programs so that it can indoctrinate more children into becoming grown up robotic tax payers and continue to propagate an increasingly corrupt system.

Answer 11

Every home schooled child I have met have been exceptionally better educated than public schooled children. I am sure there are exceptions but if they are passing state required tests they have NO right to force you not to home-school. In Russia there were children taken away from parents that home-schooled. For those of you that thinks government knows best are about to have a rude awakening.





In Georgia there is such a shortage of teachers that you can teach with an associates degree and they will get you accredited. Its called the TAPP program.

Answer 12

I home school my daughter and I just heard this on the radio about ten minutes ago.



I am not pleased with the decision but I anticipate it will be overthrown. I don't always agree with the ACLU but they have their uses in cases like this.



My religious view of this is that I prefer to teach my daughter myself so I can teach her something as opposed to send her to school to get molested, bullied, and stupid.



The good news is that in my State, they do require either a college degree or currently a religious waiver (it is my understanding that the only ones hurt by this in CA are those parents without degrees). I can easily qualify under the certified part of the law so I am not as worried as some others might be.



I anticipate that a co-op system can be set up (we have one here) with "teachers" who meet the qualifications and who can act as the teacher on paper for legal. So while I don't like the ruling I anticipate it will be dealt with in a number of ways.



My family lives in CA and they are all home schooling (they are pretty evangelical folks but we get along some how). I will have to shoot them an email to see how they are dealing with this (there are 17 kids on that side that are being home schooled.)

Answer 13

Okla. I home schooled one year and struggled to pay for Christian school for other years. Calif. is a liberal state and doesn't have the right to tell parents how to raise their children. I believe it will come down to women having babies and having to turn them over to the state to educate and indoctrinate in the future. The state and school board already think they know whats best for your child than you do anyway. Its a shame what America has come down to because of the liberals.

Answer 14

Who knows what a child needs to be taught more then a parent? I hope this law does not pass in other states because I have friends that home school. It's not like parents are teaching their children things they learned in school. Home schooling is still connected to a school that provides a computer and all the materials for learning and doing lessons.

Answer 15

The main purpose behind this is to make sure the kids are taught all the lies about evolution. They know that evolution destroys the faith of young children. However, they will pay dearly for what they are doing.



Mark 9:42 “And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.”

Answer 16

I think it's great. Kids deserve a trained teacher and it's just not true that you can do just as well without that training. Parents might know some subjects - if they have degrees in math, science, English, etc. - but on those they're not good at they're one step ahead of the kids and have nothing real to offer them. Teachers need a huge background where they can see the whole picture, in order to properly teach the particulars.



Don't even get me started on the bad, biased science AND history info in most homeschooler materials. I've heard homeschooled people say the most appallingly ignorant things.



To me, this is like those religions that don't believe in medicine - if you don't want to go to the doctor, fine, but until your kid is grown up, you don't have the freedom to put them at risk.



Education is the answer, not prejudice. It's NOT all a matter of opinion, and it's ridiculous how suspicious ignorant people are of those who have actually spent years studying something.

Answer 17

That is so stupid. I absolutely agree with you; it is not the business of the state to require you to get CREDENTIALS to teach your kid.



What about when my kid learns some bogus data in school, say from the local psychiatrist that "regular venting of hatred must occur for the individual to regain peace and conformity to his environment"? Do I have to be a licensed shrink to tell him no, don't take out your frustration on the little kids?



That's an extreme example, but not too far from the truth. You might notice that when psychiatrists talk about psychotic mass murderers they are talking like "it's not his fault, he just had maladjusted parents".



Anyways, the government would be in a LOT better position to say that if they actually made kids SMARTER. But tests show that kids in public schools actually get STUPIDER every year.



So, if the parent just taught the kid enough that he didn't get any dumber, they'd be doing better than the government ever could.

Answer 18

No, it doesn't trouble me at all. I am a Christian and I don't agree with the homeschooling thing at all.



You can't decide you're a doctor and write a prescription for your child. Why should you decide you're a teacher?



In Michigan there are NO restrictions at all...no testing to see that the kids are learning anything NOTHING...it is neglect.



Jesus said we cannot live on a mountain top. We are in the world, but not of the world.



EDIT:



One more thing...I volunteer in my son's class twice a week. I consider myself to be a creative person. I have a masters degree in social work with a post grad certification in social work.



I am AMAZED at the things his teacher comes up with to teach the students. Activities and such I would NEVER think of. She attends conferences and is up on all the new theories and teachings.



Teachers and doctors are not apples to oranges. You show disrespect when you think anyone can teach.....it is HARD, it is a SKILL, one that not everyone has.



Also, as an objective person, my son's teacher sees things I may not, helps him take lumps I may try and shield him from (that he needs to work through).

Answer 19

1. It isn't the whole state of California. It's a few counties.



2. No. Because if you're complaining that the teachers aren't qualified to teach your children, then what makes you think that YOU are qualified to do so if you don't have the proper education and preparation? There has to be SOME oversight, and SOME standard, otherwise children fall through the cracks and get lost.



It's not like it's that difficult to get yourself accredited, or to find someone who is. If you're REALLY invested in your children's future, then it's a worthwhile investment to make sure that you are equipped to give them the best education possible.

Answer 20

Lds)I think home schooling is fine, as long as testing is done a few time per year. I am hesitant, because my Daughter home schooled, and some of my Grandchildren can't spell worth a flip, but she was an exceptionally bad teacher. She was just to lazy to do it most of the time, and made the kids go out and work, so they didn't have time at home. Eventually she lost her kids for a year in Utah.

Answer 21

I disagree that an uncertified teacher should not teach children.



(I'm a teacher)



Parents need to teach their children. Many, many parents don't teach their children the basics like the alphabet, numbers, colors, their address and phone number.



They leave it up to the school to do the work.



That is not good. Parents need to have the freedom to teach their own children. It is a command in the Bible.



Parents must teach their children.

Answer 22

It's fine with me on all levels, religious or not.



Would you want your children to be taught at medical school by people without medical degrees, and then go out and start operating on you?



EDIT: Love the additional details and attacks on people with differing views.



"By comparing it to medical school, you are comparing apples to oranges and showing your inability to use common sense. Most parents that choose to homeschool are well educated and realize that their children aren't receiving a quality education in public school, which is why they choose to homeschool"



"California courts have determined that homeschooling by a parent that does not have teaching credentials is "educational neglect"



It is apples to apples, sorry. Perhaps you are the one seriously lacking in common sense.



Homeschooling by a parent without teaching credentials. Medical school with a professor without a medical degree.



Where's the problem again?

Answer 23

I am an atheist, and I agree with the Court's decision.



Should a parent with no official medical training be "allowed by law" to perform surgery on their child? Why ever not? Because they ought to have demonstrated they have some idea what they are doing, perhaps?

Answer 24

I'm cool with it.



Why should a person who is not qualified to teach a child math or science or literature and probably doesn't even know much about all of that be able to teach it to a child?



'Fraid your kiddies are going to have to be exposed to the real world and you'll have to cut the cord?



Edit: Having a degree in business does not make someone qualified to teach a child about physics or Shakespeare. There are teachers who go to college for years for the sole purpose of teaching young people those specific things. I'm a huge advocate for the traditional school system because I've often found that homeschooled kids who are overly sheltered grow up to be adults with no social skills and who can't function in the real world. I could tell ya lots of stories.

Answer 25

At first glance it seems fine to me. But I'll check out the link and think it more trough. I know how some deeply resent the government interfering at all, in their children's personal education. However I think in this case it's all for the best.





-Home-schooled, atheist agnostic.

Answer 26

i completely agree with that ruling. do you think a teacher in a public school should be qualified to teach a child, if so, then why shouldn't a parent teaching a child at home be qualified to teach children.

Answer 27

The government just wants to make sure that kids are being educated by people who are able to educate. Would you be in favor of home medical schooling?



Edit: What do you have to support your claim that most parents who choose to homeschool are qualified? And nobody is talking about taking people's kids away.

Answer 28

I think that's a tough issue. On the one hand, you don't want illiterate children, but on the other hand, you don't want the government to intrude. From what I've seen, homeschooling ranges from good to incompetent, but mostly incompetent. I think the state has a reasonable responsibility to ensure the education of children, although I'm skeptical about whether a credential is really what matters.

Answer 29

I think all children should be taught by qualified teachers, as somone trained as Lawyer may not understand maths and a doctor may have no knowledge of history. It's just my opinion.

Answer 30

It's The way Society is with there Labeling, and Guess what? It's going to get Worse, Yes?

Answer 31

I have to agree that every American child deserves the chance at a reasonable education (to help procure a secure future for us all). There is no reason why a dedicated parent cannot become accredited. Not doing so if your intent is to home-school your children yourself does seem neglectful to me.

Answer 32

As a Catholic I was home-schooled for a couple of years and I absolutely hated it! I know the schools now are trash, but they enable us to interact with other children and develop people skills.

Answer 33

I agree totally. Someone with no education isn't capable of teaching the next generation.

Answer 34

The fundamentalist Christians who homeschool their children are warping their brains, and they account for the vast majority of homeschoolers.

It makes sense to me, really, that your instructor should have credentials. But I guess if you can pass the standardised tests and get into college it doesn't matter to them.

Answer 35

I agree with California, and I homeschooled my son. I met the accreditation for my state with a BA.



Edit: If you are not sure what country you live in, maybe you needed an accreditted teacher.

Answer 36

I think that's fantastic. How many kids across the country do you think get "home-schooled" by parents that can barely read or add?

Answer 37

I agree.

According to the movie "Jesus Camp", 75% of children who are home schooled are Evangelical Christians.



Given some others I know around here- I'm guessing that the majority of that other 25% are Mormons.



'enuff said.



Atheist.

Answer 38

I agree with California, You need to meet the minimum requirements to be licensed to school children. If you do not believe you should meet minimum requirements in math, history and English fluency you are an incredibly stupid an ignorant person.

Answer 39

I'm good with it... I think some people do educationally neglect their children. Regardless of religious opinion.