Question:
Atheists : Answer this?
Acid
2007-10-19 04:27:56 UTC
For an eye to work , it needs all its part to come in function all at once , if even one single part is remaining then entire eye would die . But we still have our eyes working means everything must have had came in function all at onces rather then "evolving" over time.... how do you explain this?
28 answers:
2007-10-19 05:35:52 UTC
Atheists and Agnostic are Ignorant People



They See the Truth and Deny It



I really Dont know how can someone live like that



( Then which of your God's Favours Do you Deny? )

Al-rahman

فبای الآء ربکما تکذبان
2007-10-19 11:48:56 UTC
I know that this might frustrate you because you have asked us to simply answer your question, but in order to engage with your question, I need to know whether your question is raised out of anthropological or theological inquiry or whether (as I suspect) your concern is to offer an apologetic for the linking of the two in a particular way. It's important because my answer could be interpreted differently depending on the context in which you raise your question. Certainly it is true that theological or philosophical questions very often cannot be answered directly as the way in which a question is put can so easily prejudice the scope of answers that can be given.



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OK, so it seems you are asking a evolutionary biology question. Well, as we understand it, it is not the cell that decides but rather that the environment decides on which cells will survive. There is therefore a preference for increasing complexity. According to theories of evolution, an eye probably does not begin as an eye but probably just with some photo-sensitive cells.

The reason why we have not evolved "thicker skin" to withstand knife attacks is that our civilisation has slowed evolution. Quite properly, weaker individuals survive.



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HOW, HOW, HOW indeed! Absolutely! I find the complexity of the evolutionary process amazing! I am very interested in Captain Bunkum's answer. (Far from "Bunkum", I think).



As a Christian whose faith is centred on the cross of Jesus Christ (surely where all the pain of creation is brought into sharp focus) it all increases my appreciation of God's amazing creation. Captain Bunkum's answer reminds me of one of the great truths from the creation stories in Genesis: "it is not good that the man is alone". In other words, we need to hear the insights of each other. Aethist or not, Captain Bunkum is part of God's creation and part of God's gift to us..
Birdy is my real name
2007-10-19 11:40:35 UTC
No it does not, If you read the Richard Dawkins book "Climbing mount improbable" you will get an explanation as to how seemingly impossible organic structures have developed over millions of years. To state that because it is a hugely complex part of the anatomy now means it could not have evolved from simpler structures makes no sense and is scientifically wrong. How do you explain genetic mutations and other signs of evolution in not only humans but all animals?
Bajingo
2007-10-19 11:56:26 UTC
I think you mean evolution theory/scientists?



Atheism means not to have a belief in deities. You can still be an atheist and believe that we are created by aliens.



Try the science and biology sections. Not that I believe for a second that you really want to understand how an eye evolves.



PS: CAPITALS ARE SHOUTING, U WILL NOT GET A BETTER ANSWER BY BEING PRESUMPTIOUS,SHOUTING AND SPELLING BADLY, EVEN IF YOU MANAGE TO ASK THIS QUESTION IN THE RIGHT SECTION...
2007-10-19 11:54:04 UTC
Eyes have evolved separately at least 40 times. In none of these instances has it ever been necessary for a whole eye to evolve in one gigantic evolutionary leap.



Being sensitive to light is extremely important from a survival point of view - it enables animals to detect food and/or avoid predators. Even the smallest degree of sensitivity to light gives an advantage over a rival or predator with less sensitivity.



Eyes evolved through a continuum of small modifications and improvements from simple light sensitive spots within a cell to a single light-sensing cell, to a flat patch of light sensing cells to a cup-shape of light sensing cells (or ball-like curve in some instances, such as insects). From unfocussed to fixed focus to variable focus. From immobile to moveable. From monochrome vision to dichromatic all the way to four-colour vision as seen in turtles. The animal kingdom exhibits all forms of eyes and it is possible to trace the evolution of many of them.



The human eye actually provides excellent evidence in support of evolution:-

1. the nerves linking the light-sensitive cells to the brain lead out the front of the retina, thus partially obstructing the light heading towards the cells. This is the reverse of intelligent design and goes part-way to explaining why human (and other mammal) eyesight is poorer than other groups of animals such as octopus and squid where the nerves feed out the back of the cells. The mammal design is a result of the way the retina first evolved millions of years ago.

2. Humans only see in three colours (trichromatic vision). Many of our ape relatives and ancestors only see in two or even one colour as colour vision was much less important in low-light conditions, demonstrating that our ancestors were nocturnal. We have partially regained our colour vision by mutation of one gene which became duplicated. This can be traced through living descendants of our primate ancestors such as chimps and gibbons and permits us to calculate when the mutation ocurred and how the various groups of primates are inter-related.



Your argument that just because intermediate stages are not now in existence somehow supports the notion that the whole thing had to be created at once is a nonsense. A stone arch bridge requires all its constituent parts to function - remove just one and the arch collapses. Yet the bridge exists (without the help of god). This is because a frame was first constructed on which the arch was built, the frame subsequently being removed as unnecessary. The same applies to complex organs such as eyes, ears, liver, kidneys etc etc.



The fact that you cannot understand how things evolved does not in any way imply that they had a supernatural or godly origin but merely that you are deliberately or otherwise poorly educated.



UPDATE: I'm afraid your professor - whoever he is - is very much in the minority or scientists, most of whom are fully aware of the fallacy of irreducibility. Of course an eye functions without a lens. Some primitive eyes have no lens even today - simple cup0shapes of light-sensitive cells function perfectly well without a lens. A pin-hole camera also functions perfectly well without a lens.



Natural selection does not "choose" but it does favour by removing those forms which are less efficient. If mammals had been competing directly against squid in an environment where acute vision was at a premium then mammals may have become extinct. Natural selection has no conscious direction and cannot be reversed, only incrementally modified. The principle of the stone arch applies to all organs and forms and it is only your willful incredulity which prevents you from seeing what is obvious from the evidence.



You really should get a better education.
2007-10-19 18:54:03 UTC
since you seem to know the answer to everything....why don't you tell us. otherwise all your going to do is come back with some lame comment to which nobody can retort, unless they sign in under their other ID....like i am now....looks like you could come up with something better, because it's obvious you have put alot of effort into your rebuttals and still haven't made a decent point.......nice try though
numbnuts222
2007-10-19 11:39:40 UTC
Your understanding of how an eye works is completely flawed, nature is full of different kinds of eyes and different strengths of vision, from simple light sensitive cells to our eyes.



'I ASKED THAT FOR AN EYE TO SURVIVE ALL PARTS SHOULD BE FUNCTIONING TOGEHTER! NOT ONE BY ONE'

That assumption is wrong, the eye can still work without cone cells for instance, you'll be colour blind but it still works.



I'd research eyes again, then reformulate your question, if I were you. Though I do get the feeling that you just want to rant rather than listen, take your rant to the science section and they can laugh at you there.
2007-10-19 11:32:55 UTC
In layman's terms, it's called "scaffolding". Well explained by Daniel Dennett in "Darwin's Dangerous Idea". Piece by piece, the eye came together, just as bones from our jaws slowly migrated to form better ears.



The eye evolved. As did the heart.



Irreducible complexity has been refuted over and over. Even its progenitor, Michael Behe, has quit.



Haven't you caught on to the new creationist term "sudden emergence"?



Mammilian eyes are not the only ones that have evolved. Squids and octupi have completely different and complete eyes. Why aren't you asking about those?
2007-10-19 11:37:35 UTC
It would require a designer to make such a devise as an "EYE" the chances of that "JUST" happening would be one in 1 100000000000000000000000000000000 and add 50 more zero's.



Notice how easly some are to just say: Oh...evolution did that...no more than a car just appears after millions of years. Or you throw 1000's of little parts in the air and they all come down and form a perfect watch.....that requires more faith than I have.



my answer: God
sassy
2007-10-19 11:48:54 UTC
evolution is usually triggered for adaptation and takes place over a long time. maybe after years of surfing the net our eyes may develope a computer filter if we dont wipe each other out because of our different religions
2007-10-19 11:31:44 UTC
Not so. There are dozens of different stages of development of the eye which can be seen in living organisms *right now*. We don't even need to speculate how a less-good eye than we have might be an evolutionary advantage for the organisms which possess it, because we can actually see the evidence today.
2007-10-19 11:41:14 UTC
The entire eye wouldn't die, it's acuity wouldn't be same but it wouldn't die. What kind of "God" would make an eye that self destructs if one part is damaged?
2007-10-19 11:42:04 UTC
By that logic you'd also have to prove that the baby does not take 9 months to develop all the parts one by one but God said "be" and poof their is a fully developed baby. Can you prove that?

I think everyone here knows who's the ignorant one! lol
Fish&Rice
2007-10-19 11:34:58 UTC
thank you for showing your level of intellegence, seeing it is that way for the entire body to function. That question made no sense, when a baby is in the womb it doent look like a baby the second it is concieved.
scubalady01
2007-10-19 11:37:05 UTC
No, it doesn't mean that "everything had to happen at once". That's just bad logic. How do you explain people's eyesight going bad as they age? Wear and tear is an evolutionary process. How do you explain color blindness?
bonshui
2007-10-19 11:31:28 UTC
Why is it necessary to assume that our sight-organs have always functioned in the way they do now?



Why can't we assume that our eyes used to be simple light sensors, became more complex light and movement sensors, and eventually became sophisticated light, colour and movement sensors?



More importantly - why should this assumption be contrary to your belief in God? Why should it be the case that evolution over time is not part of (your) God's plan for his creations?
2007-10-19 11:31:29 UTC
The most primitive eyes are simply cells that can distinguish between light and dark. Over time, those cells developed into the eyes that most all creatures have. This is common scientific knowledge.
H.u.S
2007-10-19 11:35:56 UTC
If you really wanted to know the answer, you would be asking this in the Science section.



I rest my case.
Robin W
2007-10-19 11:57:04 UTC
This answers it better than I can:



Re: evolution of the eye

http://talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB301.html
I'm an Atheist
2007-10-19 11:35:05 UTC
not true... at some earlier stage of evolution, the eye could only distinguish between light and dark, then later it could see objects but only in black and white, and then finally it could see in color but its sharpness was not perfect (and still isn't)... perhaps one day out eyes will evolve until we can see as well as the eagle and some other modern animals... time will tell
2007-10-19 11:58:03 UTC
Darwin conceded that his theory failed when it came to the irreducibly complex argument that you are trying to describe.If you look at the famous ape to man chart why do we not see traces of the changes or transient fossils?This is assumption not scientific evidence.
?
2007-10-19 11:32:45 UTC
the same could be said about the heart. and theres ALOT of people walking around that have to wear glasses...why? because their eyes aren't perfect. theres alot of people walking around with heart disease too, why? because their heart isn't perfect. so i don't understand your point
2007-10-19 11:43:49 UTC
your smart, didn't darwin talk about the eye too?
2007-10-19 11:32:49 UTC
Shouldn't this be directed at oh say someone knowledgeable in human anatomy?
2007-10-19 11:43:09 UTC
Oh you HAVE to be kidding me?!?

This lame-argument again?

It's been dealt with so many times that it really should be a *drink* question.

As a matter of fact I propose that it becomes one.

All in favor?
Muslim Brother
2007-10-19 11:31:30 UTC
true

and to answer that eagle question, well thats just how allah created it.

thats not the only question

what is the purpose of life?

what happens when you die?

Is there any provern morals atheists follow by?

How could a man that couldnt read or write come up with the quran?

What do they say about all the prophets?
2007-10-19 11:34:42 UTC
Oh your God! Those sentences are ridiculous! You should be ashamed, young man.
sarahmac
2007-10-19 11:31:46 UTC
so you think god was sitting at his desk in the sky & made all our parts? i dont think so!


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