A question for all atheists, especially members of atheist groups and organizations like American Atheists?

Question

First of all, I would like to request all devout theists to stay away from this question and not answer. This is not about atheism v/s theism or anything like that, so please don't go off trying to proselytize us.Also, everyone else, please read fully before you answer as I've already anticipated some of your responses in this question, okay?

Right. Now this question is about atheist activism, or rather on whether it really is a futile struggle to promote it.American Atheist, for example, estimates there are 30 million atheists in America alone, but can only bring a few thousand onto the streets. This question addresses that disparity.

Let me compare movements to bring out my meaning.

First, the black civil rights movement. Black people can't hide the fact that they are black (at least not easily), and they were being actively mistreated.As a result, they launched their movement for fair treatment.

Homosexuals are being discriminated against and have begun to really fight back.They were not being allowed to live the life they wished to live and were being forced to conform with society, which caused them a lot of emotional distress.

Now, Atheists.If an atheist doesn't want to be troubled by overactive theists, he/she has a simple escape route. All they need do is claim to be hailing from any religion of their choice and most people will leave them alone.No one is going to be crazy enough to keep tabs on them to see if they are going to church every Sunday or anything(at least most people won't be that crazy).

Given this easy solution, how can atheist organizations expect to raise large numbers of activists.Unlike the previous two examples, an atheists life won't be too perturbed by pretending to be theist.It's an easy, practical and(yes) lazy and cowardly solution, but it is an easy solution nonetheless.

NOW, I know that this hypocrisy as well as being lazy and cowardly, but it's also harmless, practical and sensible. This isn't the Middle Ages, after all. Lot's of Christians don't even go to church regularly, some don't even go at all.It isn't going to cause an atheist any trouble- claim you're theist and they'll take it at face value.

AS for atheist pride, well, we aren't a bunch of fanatics trying to show off our faith, or rather our lack of faith.Aren't we supposed to be rational, practical folk. What's the use needlessly suffering for pride?I thought that to be a theistic obsession.

So, given all this, is there any chance of even a fraction of those (estimated) 30 million atheists going through all the trouble of coming onto the streets to protest when they have a far easier solution available to them? Are these organizations just deluding themselves?

Answer 1

the case is simple



the USA is suppose to be a secular state... apparently that is one of the great things about the country....But there are many things within the USA that are government controlled and are based on religion



For example...'in god we trust' on your $1 notes...you may think thats not a big thing...well, what about..'there is no god'...

You can say that just silly, it doesn't effect anyone anyways. IT looks like it does.



Another thing, for example, same sex marriages, now im not saying all atheist are pro same sex marriages. But the law making on that subject is heavily based on religion, and that the church clames what is marriage and what isn't.



Abortion, now, again, not all atheist are pro choice...but you look me in the eye and say that religion has no effect of the law making.

.

and also the lack of tax on churches



Its things like that, something that a pure secular state should not have.

Answer 2

I think it was Dawkins who said that you have a better chance of herding cats than getting atheists to organise.



I don't feel I belong to a club and disbelief is a tenuous reason to unite behind anything.



However if I felt my right to disbelief was threatened then I might be galvanised into joining something.

Answer 3

Blah blah blah blah blah - surely you could have asked this in less words.



Your premise here is simply ridiculous. What you seem to be saying is that if someone doesn't like our stance on the issue, we should simply lie. Yeah, right, that's how change happens - everyone just lies so we all get along. I'm guessing you can work out where you can stick that idea...

Answer 4

You sound like a fundamentalist bully, I am guessing that atheists can just do what they like, instead of what you say they should do.



I also don't think that atheists shouldn't say they belong to a mainstream religion, so as to be left alone, that's a preposterous suggestion, I think I get it now, you are going to say that we are all agnostics anyway or some such bullcrap.

Answer 5

Dude noone will read it -.- it's too much to read xD

Answer 6

Normally I don't answer questions this long. This time I will.



I don't really think you have to do much of anything, as more and more people in the US are just not that religious anymore. Fewer people are going to church, although the amount of people that say they believe in God seems to be staying about the same in polls (I disagree with the polls and say that atheism seems to be increasing). I am not an atheist myself but I do support legal efforts to keep religious beliefs out of government. The reason some atheists keep quiet is fear of retribution by religious extremists. If you say you are an atheist in many places in the "Bible belt" you can pretty much expect harassment and trouble from them. If you really want to change things then you have to make a public stand which has its own risks. Otherwise you can just vote for candidates that support your views. If you simply wait long enough atheists will probably become the majority in this country. The last census indicated that they are 9% of the population, but before that the census indicated a much lower number (2% - I think).

Answer 7

no-one should have to lie about or hide who they are just because soceity has a problem with them, or because soceity cant help but to judge them



if atheists can hide who they are, then so can christians, muslims, and yes even homosexuals and all others who are nor 'physicaly obvious'

but thats not how todays soceity works, or how it shoudl work



and everyone is entitled to protest soemthing, thts fredom of speech and its alsohow tings change



this ISNT the middle ages, yoru right

and thats WHY we can and wil do this

and ts also why you should not have said we shoudl hide who we are to keep the peace





i dontknow anything about atheist pride

nor do i protest or anything else



but i would hope that peopel liek you dont deny my rights to if and when i felt i had to just becuae you dont agree that im 'openly atheist'

Answer 8

I don't needlessly suffer because i'm an atheist, and to be honest it doesn't seem like anyone in my country (England) gives a monkeys about ones belief system, as long as that belief system does not harm others.

Answer 9

crack is bad

so is meth

Answer 10

Most atheists in today's society already pretend to be theists in disguise. This is because revealing an atheist stance in most societies is almost suicidal.



However, it only serves as an insult to theists that the atheists amongst them shirk from revealing their identity out of fear of social boycott and backlash.



Pretending to be someone you're not is awfully painful and humiliating. What we need now is movements and organizations to come forward and put out the message that, yes, there are atheists amongst us, and atheists are people just like you and me, but without belief in a deity.



Hiding amongst the theists forever is not the solution. What you offered as solution is NOT a cake-walk, 'cause it takes a lot out of atheists to go around following religious observances even though inside they don't give a sh*t about them.



How would you like following religious observances and going around telling you're religious when you don't believe in religions in the first place? Because such religious observances like going to church and the likes have no meaning to me, and no purpose.



This has to change. Theists have to face themselves to the fact that there ARE atheists amongst them, atheists who have the right to freely express their religious positions and live the way they want.



And I think that's the purpose of the atheist organizations.

Answer 11

We are simply trying to offer enough of a challenge to prevent a return to the dark ages. If we keep religion out of law and science classrooms, we've succeeded.

Answer 12

"AS for atheist pride, well, we aren't a bunch of fanatics trying to show off our faith, or rather our lack of faith.Aren't we supposed to be rational, practical folk"



Wow, why do you feel the need to start a movement? You think you can look for an easy solution to "being troubled by overactive theists" when we all have a right to our own beliefs? It looks like you are fishing for ways to snuff out religious tolerance, well I have an easier solution for you, China is imprisoning Christians, maybe you can move there.

Answer 13

Um, protest what?

If there was a march in the streets to get Creationist Religion out of the Science class I would carry a sign, but I'd also rent a bullet proof vest because there are nuts out there that own guns, and they see atheists as influenced by Satan.



Simple escape route? 'All they need do is claim to be hailing from any religion of their choice'.

I need no disguise. I'm not going to lie to make a point.

I don't base my self worth, or pride on being an atheist.

Your tone is sinister and arrogant.

Is Ted Haggard one of your close friends?

Answer 14

I've never felt the need to lie about my lack of belief to get the church bullies off my back. Most people consider religion a private matter and rarely (if ever) discuss it. The choice to follow religion or not is your own business and is nobody else's concern. I've never lost a job from being atheist. Religious discrimination is illegal, and they are not allowed to ask your religion. If someone won't associate with me because I'm atheist...that's their problem, not mine.

Answer 15

I have no need to go and publicly protest against theism, or to proclaim my atheism. I don't need to belong to an organization that promotes atheism, because people are well aware of their options and atheism will come naturally to those who aren't afraid of it. It's not cowardly, I just have no reason to join any such organization.

Are these organizations deluding themselves? I do not think so, but I see no difference between such an organization and any religious organization...collecting money for the betterment of the organization.

Answer 16

I thought atheism wasn't a cult. I thought it just categorized people who lack belief in a religion. The atheist club seems like a good place to talk about this stuff. I don't think people persecuting atheists in anyway. I could be wrong, there are a lot of psychos like that out there.

Answer 17

paul nailed it. atheists in certain areas of the world face discrimination that is quite damaging. there are places in some countries where standing up and saying "i'm an atheist - you people need to get your heads on straight about this god nonsense" is on par with standing up at the salem with trials a while back and saying "i'm a pagan - you people need to get your heads screwed on straight and learn to worship the earth" (just go with it for the sake of the argument)



yeah..it would be a quick bonfire.



if not a literal bonfire, it would be damned close. so, while some of us share our belief system (or non-belief) with family and friends, we don't wear it like a banner, cause we don't enjoy getting roasted. i get enough grief from my family already. besides, i don't shove my beliefs down others throats. i ask that they do the same. if i am asked, i don't hide what i believe, but i don't argue about it.



i don't try to convert. i ask others (who have religious beliefs) to try and be as respectful. the only rule of religion and religious belief should be keep your religion to yourself. and out of everyone else's business, bedroom, politics, schools, uterus and *ss.

Answer 18

I agree with the point you're making.

Traditionally support groups exist to raise awareness and increase support for a specific issue.

In the case of atheism, it doesn't really make sense to rally around the concept that things don't exist. The Atheist has been saying "prove it" since the beginning of time and hasn't gotten an answer that establishes the existence of God.

Answer 19

1) I read it, Jim.



2) Well, atheists are not joiners by nature. Sort of goes with the mindset.



We don´t like being organized. Individual freedom and all that. The reverse effect goes for Christianity.

Answer 20

Why should they claim to be any religion like theist when they re not. Atheists are prejudiced against, they should be able to proudly say they are atheists and not have any problems. I would take part in a march for atheist rights even though I am not one.

Answer 21

Its not about peace..its about being non delusional and helping others come out of their delusions...thts why athiests do all tht..

If the all the ppl in the world become athiests and u are thiest will u hide u say im an athiest for the sake of peace? No ...

Answer 22

Junior, we just don't believe in a god that's all. Most of us aren't involved in any organisations because we're kinda post-theistic...and even post-atheistic.

Answer 23

Ask it in one or two sentences.

Answer 24

that is unbelievably stupid. i don't even know what to say, except i cannot believe i wasted my time reading that crap.

Answer 25

hmmmmmmmmmmm

Answer 26

Atheists are full of shyte!!!!

Answer 27

In my case, it is a matter of public service to tell everybody what the Bible God believed by the Christians is all about. Atheists have no Bible of their own. So we are forced to quote from religious books like the Bible that Christians hate to read!



You probably heard the name of "SLAUGHTER HOUSE RELIGION" given to Christianity. ALL Christians need to snack God the Son Jesus Christ in some way as part of the “salvation” package. Jesus talked about eating his meat and drinking his blood to go to Heaven when you die!



John 6:53 (KJV) Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you (DUCK!), Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.



It takes years of Christian and Catholic schooling to learn how to serve the Holy Communion just right, or Christians can get real sick and die! Protestants have relaxed this warning, but Catholics still believe that the Host* (*wafer) and Wine is magically transformed into the ACTUAL spit flavored Meat and sweaty Blood of Jesus. In some parishes extraordinary measures are taken after Mass to monitor that no trace of the body of Jesus Christ is found in any spent chewing gum stuck under the Church pews, or anywhere else!



1 Corinthians 1:29-30 (KJV) For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many SLEEP* (*have died. More Mafia talk! Low IQ Christians who are sick are screwing up the Holy Communion, or how else can they get sick? Spiritually speaking, of course!).



The Christian writers of the NT were delighted to declare that in fulfillment of Bible prophecies Jesus Christ’s flesh was beaten to a pulp, thoroughly tenderized, and heavily marinated in Roman soldiers’ spit, as the “spotless Lamb of God taking away the sins of the world” while hanging totally naked nailed to a Holy Cross!



Job 17:6 (NIV) God has made me* (*Jesus) a byword to everyone* (*when “God the Father laid on HIM the iniquity of us all”), A MAN IN WHOSE FACE PEOPLE SPIT* (*this is about the most dominant prophecy about Jesus! Preachers play cool on this one for obvious reasons!).



Many years after Jesus died, the Christian NT Bible writers run amok highlighting the events in the alleged life of God the Son Jesus Christ that fulfill Bible prophecies, and this is one of them! It is kinda sh*tty spiritually speaking, of course, but there is hardly any other “prophecy” more precise than this one!



Matthew 26:67 (NIV) Then they SPIT IN HIS FACE and struck him with their fists. Others slapped him.

Matthew 27:30 (NIV) They SPIT ON HIM, and took the staff and struck him on the head again and again.

Mark 14:65 (NIV) Then some began to SPIT AT HIM; they blindfolded him, struck him with their fists, and said, "Prophesy!" And the guards took him and beat him.

Mark 15:19a (NIV) Again and again they struck him on the head with a staff and SPIT ON HIM.



That’s almost a Gallon of Goy spit, not Jewish, but Gentile spit! The preachers go wild announcing that the Jews rejected Jesus, but the ultimate form of the most humiliating spitting rejection ever put together comes from the Romans, not from the Jews! The Gospel writers imply that there was something very obvious about Jesus’ personality that invited a lot of Roman spit! No Holy Roman authority EVER apologized for having had a field day spitting on Jesus’ face, even when they were ruling Christian Europe for so many centuries! I am telling like it is, and I still keep getting email calling me a blasphemer!



There is no historical record that the Roman soldiers ever let their victims take a shower after a heavy dose of spitting. Honestly, the Roman soldiers were not known to spit on anybody! The Bible writers had to show that this prophecy about “spitting on Jesus’ face” was fulfilled! There is no record that the Romans dressed any of their victim’s genital area in a white diaper before nailing them to any cross no matter how holy! There is no record that the Romans crucified anybody in Jerusalem, either. The Romans were much better known to IMPALE their victims driving a thick pole into the victim’s rectum and forcing them to stand on it until the pole would eventually pierce the heart or lung killing them by their own body weight! The thicker the pole, the longer it took for the victim to die! The Roman soldiers had plenty of fun that way! Jesus hardly suffered a sissy man’s death hanging his full body weight so gently from a nail in each hand. The nails can’t possibly hold anybody hanging in there for any length of time! Christians are brainwashed to believe that crucifixion is the most tormenting death ever invented! Not so! Impalement would have been a real pain in Jesus anal cavity and still fulfill Bible prophecy about “hanging on a tree!” If Jesus were to have a pole stuck up into his anus then he would have had his eyes popping out of their orbit, and he would be crying non-stop for his Daddy God up in Heaven like a charm! According to the Christian Bible writers, Jesus Christ was able to conduct a long heated conversation with his peers nailed to the other crosses, and with some of the guests at the crucifixion site, and with the Roman soldiers that crucified him, all in Yiddish! The Roman foot soldiers spoke Latin!



About 500 years ago, the Protestants wised up and removed the hanging corpse of Jesus Christ from the Cross. Now, only Catholics still display a dead body nailed to the Holy Cross. ALL Christians and Catholics must snack on Jesus’ spit flavored Meat and drink his sweaty blood in the Sacrament of the Holy Communion, aka “The Lord’s Supper” to go to “Heaven” when they die! Christianity is a very primitive religion. Most people in America are unable to function without it!

Answer 28

WHA............?