I just wanted make a few points against religion and was interested what any opposing sides might have to say.?

Question

interesting points I would like to make

* If God is all-powerful, why did he take 6 days to create the universe, resting on the 7th? Why didn't he just snap his proverbial fingers and create everything all at once, and not need rest afterwards? Doesn't sound so all-powerful to me.
* If God knows the future, why does he make mistakes? He should have known he would regret the flood, and that Sodom and Gomora would be full of sinners, etc.
* Why does God need to be "served", and why can't we do it from heaven?
* Yes, we have free will, but God already knows who will sin, who will accept Him, etc, for all eternity (since he has perfect knowledge of the future). Why then, are we here? Why not just send our souls to Heaven or Hell, depending on what he knows we'll do?
* Why does God care if he is praised? He is this all-knowing, super being, why does he care if we mere humans give him credit for creating the universe?
* How can you justify the fact that this merciful, loving god is sending all non-Christians to Hell, no matter how good they are? Even those from before Christ was born went to hell. However, terrible people, including Hitler and Jeffrey Dahmer, could go to Heaven if they repented before death.
* Why does this wonderful, forgiving God hold Adam's sin over all our heads? Why must we all pay for this by being permanent sinners? If God was so pissed, why didn't he just kill Adam and Eve and start over? Again, this is God's choice, so they're going to have to explain why God CHOOSES to hold this incredible grudge.
* Where did God come from? How did he get created? Why is it a valid argument to say that He "always existed", but an invalid argument to say the same thing about matter and energy?
* Why would god have to make a son to forgive us for our sins, why couldn't he just do it...I'm not putting him for the father of the year award to say the least.

Imagine for a minute that you are God with all his unlimited powers.

1) You decide that for some reason that the people on planet Earth need guidance for their own good. Do you

(a) Appear before one person in a vision, give them secret instructions and hope they pass it on correctly and don't take liberties, or

(b) Appear before the masses and tell them direct, thereby proving your existence beyond doubt and at the same time ensuring that they get the right message.

2) You wish to have your laws continued forever. Do you

a) Tell them once and disappear for a couple of thousand years or more, or

(b) Make regular appearances to reinforce belief.

3) You care for these people, so when you see things going terribly wrong, do you

a) Sit back and watch the fun, or

(b) Step in again with some timely advice.

4) You have unlimited powers, you can create the world any way you want. Do you

(a) Make the climate changeable and unpredictable resulting in the deaths of millions due to drought, floods, heat waves etc. Or

(b) Create a stable climate so that the population can grow their crops and feed themselves.


Quotes that I wanted to include as well:

Geology shows that fossils are of different ages. Paleontology shows a fossil sequence, the list of species represented changes through time. Taxonomy shows biological relationships among species. Evolution is the explanation that threads it all together. Creationism is the practice of squeezing one's eyes shut and wailing "does not!."
- Anonymous, chat room

On a Bored God:
· 12-14 billion years ago god created the Universe
· 5 billion years ago he started with our Earth
· 3 million years ago he started with humankind
· 150,000 years ago he started with the current version of humankind
· 5,000 years ago he revealed himself to humankind (so they say)
· And for only 2,000 years he has been able to "enjoy" Christian people

On a timescale of the Universe (100 percent):
· the Earth has existed for 42 percent of the time
· Ape-man existed since 0.025 percent of the time
· Humankind itself has existed for 0.00125 percent of the time
· The Christian faith has existed for 0.000042 percent of the time (rounded upwards)
· the time God has been able to enjoy Christian people is 0.000017 percent (rounded upwards).
Thus, god has, for 99,999982 percent of time (rounded downwards = 1,199,999,784,000 years), been bored, has done nothing. He has been waiting for us, only to leave us behind "alone" once again. Why? For eating an apple, that's why! I know time is nothing to God, but this is preposterous.
- Sogree,

"Gods are fragile things; they may be killed by a whiff of science or a dose of common sense."
- Chapman Cohen

"Lighthouses are more helpful than churches."
- Benjamin Franklin

"Religions are all alike - founded upon fables and mythologies."
- Thomas Jefferson

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? then he is malevolent.

Answer 1

wow. i honestly have nothing useful to say, but i wanted you to know how much i enjoyed reading this!! you have asked many of the same questions that i have, and even made a few points that i never thought of! so thanks for a great read. i enjoyed it.

Answer 2

All interesting and valid points.



I too would like to hear some reasonable arguments from the opposing side.



What I've heard so far in my 3 1/2 years here has fallen a bit shy of the water..

Answer 3

Virtually all of your points are restricted to the beliefs of Evangelical Protestantism, which comprises less than 10% of the Christian population (much less "religion" in general). The quotes at the end are apparently meant to be an appeal to authority, but it would be better to provide quotes that actually represent the theological views of the persons quoted (especially Jefferson and Franklin, neither of whom were opposed to religion).



The final paraphrase of the Epicurean Paradox has already been rejected by atheist philosophers because a) it says nothing about the existence of God, and b) uses several unsubstantiated theological assumptions to disprove its own premises.

Answer 4

I’ll respond to you in the same order you said it, from my Jewish perspective (and since you said ‘religion’, I’ll assume that any religious viewpoint can respond to your points).



* Nowhere in the Torah does it say that Hashem needed the rest. Also, since it’s a creation story, I doubt accuracy was the writers’ intent with that tale.

* Knowing what could happen is a bit different from knowing what will happen. Besides, when has knowing the future made someone perfect?

* Hashem doesn’t need to be served.

* Hashem doesn’t know all those things, since fate and free will clash – the why we’re here is a question religions hope to answer, usually.

* Hashem doesn’t care if people praise it.

* Why did you say religion in your question if you meant Christianity? Honestly.

* Again with the Christianity.

* No idea for the first two. It’s not an invalid argument.

* Continuing with the Christianity = Religion thing, I see.



Neither! I make a pact with a single group of people and go with it.



I tell them, and they remember it pretty well (and argue about it).



I do nothing, since the last few times I’ve interfered in the world at large it hasn’t turned out well (flood, anyone?).



Not really relevant to religion as a whole. Who’s to say that a deity isn’t responsible for natural processes?



Again with the Christianity, this is getting old.



Despite your obvious concern with Christianity, I fail to see why Hashem would revolve around humanity.



They may, or they may not. Mine hasn’t.



Yes they are, fail to see how that’s against religion.



That’s sort of the point, isn’t it?



Or Hashem is able and willing, but doesn’t feel the need to interfere where humans could do it by themselves.



My Note: Your points have less to do with religion and more to do with Christianity. Use Christianity in your question next time.

Answer 5

the biggest question is this: if god is perfect, why does he admit to possessing flawed human emotions?



in the ten commandments to his people: do not worship any other god before me, for your lord god is a jealous god.





jealousy is one of the seven deadly sins, by the way.

Answer 6

religion vaccines

Answer 7

God made the us for himself because there is nothing greater. Its ultimately meaningless to be good at sports or have some worldly goal or accomplishment or purpose in life. God is good and he is bounded by his goodness. It would not be good to let evil people into Heaven therefore he does not do it. Most people have free will and choose evil. Would it really be that much of a bother to watch a video on the Shroud of Turin, or investigate the Miracle of the Sun in Fatima that had 70000 witnesses? Those are my questions for you. http://store.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/dvjeandshoft.html

Answer 8

God has all-knowledge.

I would recommend you get it, too.

Answer 9

This is much more than just "a few" points. I could refute all this, but it would take too long, and I have other things to do today

Answer 10

Many of your points have to do with the concept of free will versus God's sovereign control. I believe God knows what paths each of us will choose of our own free will. So, we are responsible for the consequences of our decisions but God knows the outcome ahead of time. I tend to agree with the answer on this subject provided by FREEDOM a few days ago: God knows events before they occur and the character and choices of men before they are born (Ac. 2:23; Ro. 8:29; 11:2; 1 Pe. 1:2). God planned man's salvation before the creation (Ep. 1:5,11). This does not mean God arbitrarily chooses who will be saved and who will not be. He has revealed that He wants all men to be saved (1 Ti. 2:3,4; Jn. 3:16; 2 Pe. 3:9). God knows the future and knows who will receive His offer of salvation; predestination is based on God's foreknowledge and has more to do with what the Christian is predestinated TO than WHO is predestinated (1 Pe. 1:2; Ro. 8:29). Predestination assures eternal salvation.Forordain is God's prior knowledge of and bringing to pass of events according to His will (1 Pe. 1:20). Foreordain is translated from the same Greek word as foreknow