Judaism: Interested in ?

Question

Lately, I have been researching more and more about Judaism and I honestly believe that this is the right path for me. Now, recently, I have been thinking about converting to Judaism(Reform). I know it won't be an easy route, but I am willing to go threw the proccess. I do, however have some basic questions about Judaism..

-How long is the conversion proccess ?
- How do I go about the proccess of conversion ?

Also, I do have another question.. I know that there are 4 branches of Judaism(Reform, Reconstructionist, Conservative, Orthodox), but what is all the talk about Messianic Jews ? I've heard that these people are really Christians, but I am not entirely sure. Are these people really Christians ? If so, how can I tell ?

**Repost from last night, due to lack of answers**

Answer 1

Answer: determine which branch of Judaism is calling to you – Orthodox, Conservative, Reconstructionist or Reform. Find a synagogue of that branch near you and talk with the rabbi.



Typically, there is an Intro to Judaism class that can last 16 lessons (with a break in the winter or spring, depending on when the class starts). During that time you’ll be expected to attend Shabbat services and holiday observances at the synagogue and bringing more and more of the mitzvot (commandments) into your life, moving closer and closer to living life as a Jew.



After the class you’ll work one-on-one with the rabbi or an elder on any areas you might need more study. When the rabbi considers you are ready, you will be referred to a rabbinical court (who aren’t out to sink anyone). They determine if the candidate understands enough about Judaism and is living life as a Jew (except for saying the blessings on Shabbat).



If the candidate is male and approved, they will have to been circumcised or a ritual drop of blood drawn from the genitals (with appropriate numbing agent applied). Men and women converts then go to a mikvah, a ritual immersion in water with appropriate prayers. When one emerges, they are considered 100% Jewish.



Now, the different branches don’t all recognize conversions by other branches (much like some Christian denominations don’t consider other denominations as REAL Christians).



Orthodox – recognize only Orthodox conversions.

Conservative – recognize Conservative and Orthodox conversions

Reconstructionist – recognize all conversions

Reform – recognize all conversions.



The State of Israel recognizes all conversions as legitimate but only Orthodox Jews can marry in Israel or be buried in a Jewish cemetery. Non-Orthodox go to Cyprus, get married and their marriage is then recognized in Israel.



Orthodox = 2 – 3 years to convert

Conservative = 2 – 2 1/2 years

Reconstructionist – 2 – 2 1/2 years

Reform – 1 – 1 1/2 years



Side note: “Messianic Jews” are NOT Jewish and are NOT accepted in any branch of Judaism. They are Christian sects with Christian beliefs and some are intentionally deceptive in their attempts to convert Jews. “Messianics” are NOT recognized as Jewish by any Jewish branch nor by Israel nor by the US military. They are Christians despite calling their churches synagogues and their ministers “rabbis”



Recommended books: The Complete Idiot's Guide to Understanding Judaism (a real book by a rabbi); Choosing Judaism; Living Judaism; Jewish Literacy; What is Special about Judaism; What is a Jew; The Jewish Home (Amazon.com used books is a great resource - odds are these or most of these will be required in your class and the synagogue can order them for you)

Answer 2

I like how open you are about the religion. I studied Judaism a long time ago in college, and I have been wanting to visit a synagogue in my area. As far as what they believe in, I will agree that their views are interesting and rational.

Answer 3

I'm not in the USA - so if you are, as I assume given the branches of Judaism that you name), I can't give you all the detail as things are a bit different in the UK and Europe. However, there will definitely be at least - I emphasise that, at least - a year of studying including classes and one-to-one learning as well as self-study. Along with that, you will expected to attend services at least once on shabbat and to be involved with all the other festivals in the course of a year.



"Messianic Jews" believe in things that are totally inimicable to Judaism. They seem determined that they are not Christians, which is fine by me, but they're certainly not Jews and their beliefs certainly overlap substantially with Christianity. You will know because they refer to Yeshua (their Hebrewised version of Jesus) and use the New Testament, albeit in Hebrew (because they think there's something fancy about that, even though it's not its original language). They do a number of weird things with Jewish festivals. As soon as you've learned anything much about Jewish festivals, it will be pretty obvious when they're being perverted in the strange ways they do (in order to back-engineer 'Yeshua' into them).



To begin the process of conversion, I suggest that you initially approach your nearest Reform synagogue and say you'd like to start coming to services. You'll probably find that members of the synagogue help you through the service. Get familiar with things there, get to know people - and then (assuming you remain certain that this is your path) approach the rabbi and request that s/he accept you as a candidate for conversion.



And if you do go ahead, I am sure you will have a wonderful journey with it. It's not the right path for everyone, but for those for whom it is, it's a joy and delight.

Answer 4

I'm sorry, I tend to be a bit militant today but in my eyes you should think about this wish carefully if you really want to do this to you. I learned today at the Kiddush table from our Rabbi that my Jewish family abroad is "not Jewish" because they are members of Reform communities and our Rabbi states that Reform Judaism is not Judaism but another religion like Christianity that is only close to Judaism, so these relatives were not Jewish any more. :-( I was very "happy" about this opinion and actually that angry that I think about boycotting my community for the next weeks. So be aware that there are not only people outside that do not recognize people with non-orthodox Guirim as not Jewish but as well born Jews that are inside Reform and think about it if you really want to deal with such things from time to time. Moreover Jews tend to be more curious than the average people in a small village and you can be sure if you tell something to someone in your community that pretty soon everyone knows even if this kind of "information channel" is generally forbidden ("evil tongue"). Sorry that I do not give you a more nice and positive answer today - it was not "my day" and i think you should know that Judaism isn't perfect, it has pros and cons just like any other religion; sometimes probably even more; and you should think carefully about it if you really want it. If so, contact a Rabbi. Apart from that Aravah's answer is the one that might help you most.Good luck!

Answer 5

I converted to Reform. To answer your questions:



- it took me about a year: meeting with a rabbi about every 3 weeks; taking a course (Intro to Judaism); reading a book about the history of Judaism; attending Shabbat and High Holy Day services



- the process itself involves meeting with a beit din (in my case, 3 rabbis) who asked me questions, mostly about my motivations and how I expected to continue to my study (you'll see Judaism kind of involves lifelong learning) - there were no "right answers" - then submerging in a mikveh and saying a couple of prayers in Hebrew. Then we had a short service afterwards.



Before the actual conversion ceremony, I had a hatafat dam brit (symbolic circumcision) and I chose my Hebrew name.



- to start, just contact a Reform synagogue and set an appointment with a rabbi.



- Yes, Messianic Jews are Christians. Judaism sets forth very specific criteria for the messiah, none of which Jesus fulfilled. Messianic Jews, who believe in Jesus as the messiah and are expecting his second coming, also believe in other classically Christian and non-Jewish things, like the Devil, Hell, salvation, martyrdom of Christ, etc.

Answer 6

You missed the ultra conservative Chasidic branch but you're right messianic Jews are a branch of Christianity that are emulating the first century Hebraic christians who follow Christ AND the law of moses to the best of their abilities. They see themselves as the true christians but other christians see them as apostate as after having been justified by their faith in Christ they are seeking to again be justified by the law, in defiance of the new testament teaching on the subject. All Jews that I'm aware of are united on the subject that messianic Jews are Christians. To complicate matters though many Christians see themselves as Jews, a position Jews will naturally reject. There is, however, a growing movement within Judaism to recognise that they are the "parent" religion of both Christianity and Islam and that they have a responsibility towards Christians and Muslims in the same way that Parents have a responsibility towards their children.



I have to say though I'm in the same boat as yourself, I'm just learning.

Answer 7

The reason Messianics most often deny that they are Christians is because they take issue with their understanding of what the term Christian means. Originally, it was a slur in the first place by the pagans in Antioch of the new followers (likewise Antiochians) of the man Christians now call Jesus the Christ. Why exactly that bothers non-Jewish Messianics (yes, most Messianics are not Jews but following a type of Judaism instead) I don't' know. Also, Jews who come to accept Jesus (they use his Hebrew or Aramaic name usually) as the foretold Messiah of Israel object to it because they do not accept that they turned into Gentiles by coming to Messiah Yeshua (or Yehoshua, however one wants to spell/say it). You're going to hear a lot or propaganda about Messianic Judaism in Rabbinical circles. And inside of Messianic Judaism it gets pretty weird too. The Way is the Messiah. He is alive. He rose from that grave and is the only one who can navigate you through this mess. He alone is the living Word of God who knows exactly what all the written Word of God means, meant, how it applies to you vs me, or some other Jew. He knows it all, understands it all, and you can't get a better Teacher/Rabbi. Ask God. If you think that Judaism is for you, ask the God of Moses. He WILL answer you if you ask Him sincerely. He answered me when I was a lonely little 10 year old kid stuck in my mothers christian cult. Ask Hasheem, He will show you 'the Way". No joke, this is not just advice, your very soul depends on you cryiing out the the Lord on this one. May my God, my Lord, light you Way as He did for me. God bless you and keep you His. Amen. Shalom, And may the devil miss.

Answer 8

You will benefit from converting to Orthodox if you are neurotic kind of personality suffering of anxiety and never sure if you are doing every little thing exactly as it should be done: there you will find precise instructions on everything, including how to use toilet the right way (not a joke).



You will benefit from converting to any liberal branch (Conservative, Reform, Reconstructionist) if you are looking for a social environment with nice friendly and highly intellectual people, often socially involved and active. Really good if your are looking for educational opportunities.



Conversion to Messianic is about real faith and not any formal procedure, so it is more about relationship with God than with people, which I understand is not of interest for you. If you still want to clarify, I would suggest that you simply visit a Messianic congregation next to you and get a first hand experience, just to avoid getting into the crossfire of different camps of answerers.



A general note: Jews are the heirs of Abraham's covenant with God. Therefore, I would say that circumcision is an integral part of any form of entering into the covenant.

Answer 9

Go and talk to a rabbi or some Jewish people

Answer 10

***I have been researching more and more about Judaism and I honestly believe that this is the right path for me.***



Please tell us about this research: books and articles read that would tell you that polydox Jews would need to "convert." Convert to what?



***survey commissioned that year by the Central Conference of American [Reform] Rabbis, reported that “Only one in ten [Reform] rabbis states that he believes in G-d ‘in the more or less traditional Jewish sense.’”[20] The remaining ninety-percent classified their faith with terms like: “Agnostic;” “Atheist;” “Bahai in spirit, Judaic in practice;” “Polydoxist;”***

http://www.simpletoremember.com/articles/a/reformconservativeorthodox/



Seriously, surely you knew that 90% of Reform Rabbis classified their faith with terms like *** “Agnostic;” “Atheist;” “Bahai in spirit, Judaic in practice;” “Polydoxist;”***



So how, exactly, does one convert to being an Atheist" Jew unless you are currently a Gentile who believes in the living, acting, and speaking God of Israel? Do tell us how you can personally know God and feel you need to convert to a belief where you don't believe God exists?



After all, in your research, you surely came across the writings of Rabbi Reines.



***Alvin J. Reines (1926-2004) was an American Reform rabbi, philosopher and theologian. He was professor of Philosophy and Theology at Hebrew Union College. He is known for his pluralistic religious philosophy and theology of 'Polydoxy.' 'Polydoxy' emphasizes individual autonomy and religious freedom.... Polydoxy is presented as the opposite of orthodoxy.***

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alvin_J._Reines



I am sure you read pages 135 to 137 in Reform Judaism: The Shock of Freedom

http://www.polydoxinstitute.org/pdfs/ReformJudShockFreedm_1.pdf



After all, when you are converting to NOT believing in



1. God

2. the Jewish Scriptures



celebrating



3. the Sabbath

4. the Feast



that means you want to convert to not doing these things like most Reform Jews!



While I find it difficult how you can move from "knowing what the God of Israel Israel made you to do"

to

"the uncertainty taught by a polydox rabbi"



I am sure this has brought you what you have resolved to want.



After all, even Judaism 101 says,



***Who is a Jew?

A Jew is any person whose mother was a Jew or any person who has gone through the formal process of conversion to Judaism.



It is important to note that being a Jew has nothing to do with what you believe or what you do.***

http://www.jewfaq.org/whoisjew.htm



And since you are converting to being a Reform Jew which ***has nothing to do with what you believe or what you do.***, then naturally, you currently have a uniform belief system where it matters what you believe and what you do.



Please tell us more about wanting to convert to not having a belief when you currently had one. Does that make you currently one who believes like Orthodox Jews since



***Polydoxy is presented as the opposite of orthodoxy.***

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alvin_J._Reines



If so, when you actually have a defined list of what makes a Jew a Jew, you will either have a list of requirements which is directly opposed by 90% of Reform Jews or being Jewish is reduced from being God's chosen people to a very old club loosely associated with some ancient myths.



Therefore, if you establish a list, Messianic Jews keep more of the list and therefore are more Jewish than Reform Jews.



If there is no official list established, then being Jewish is determined by the club you belong as they independently make up their own list of who they want as members/ affiliate and who they want to exclude...in which case, excluding Messianics has nothing to do with a uniform system of beliefs as no one calling themselves Jews obey all the laws defined in the Torah.



Instead, you have clubs that have nothing to do with the God of Israel or Jewish scriptures excluding from their membership the Jews who believe there is a God of Israel who speaks and acts as all the Jewish scriptures teach.



PS



A general note: Jews are the heirs of Abraham's covenant with God only if bloodlines are the only rational of a person being Jewish which is what 1 Kings 16 to 22 teaches. Of course, to state this publicly brings out



the groups that never want to SHARE the list of what makes a Jews a Jew

AND

maintain this is antisemitic because it was the method Hitler used to determined what makes a Jew a Jew.



When you find "intelligent, well educated Jews" separating who is and who is not a Jew without EVER WANTING TO REVEAL HOW OTHER THAN "I AM JEWISH," then you know



1. whether their mother (oral Torah) / father (Tanakh) is Jewish

2. whether they believe in the God of Israel who speaks and acts

3. whether they hold the Jewish scriptures to be true and given by God.

are optional...otherwise they would state it as a requirement of membership.

Answer 11

I will only be interested in Judaism if it makes me rich and running Hollywood like the Jews. Does that come with the package?