Question:
Atheists: I can prove that God exists. Will you convert now?
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:02:27 UTC
I can prove that God exists in 3 different ways. Let me show you:

1. Newton's Law of conservation of mass states that no matter can be created or destroyed. That means that any matter currently in the universe must have either existed forever or been created by an omnipotent God. Since atheists admit that the universe is finite, then it must be the latter.

2. Miracles happen every day. My aunt went to the hospital with a severe form of cancer and was given a 0% chance of survival by trained, professional doctors. Despite that, she kept praying everyday and managed to survive the catastrophic disease, even when the doctor's hope was futile.

3. Life without God is purposeless. Do you really think we just randomly appeared here for no reason? Even if you do, do you really believe that something as complex as the human eye could just form by chance, with no intervention whatsoever?
24 answers:
Brigalow Bloke
2012-08-02 06:30:25 UTC
Yes, I thought you were new.



The overall energy and therefore mass of the Universe may be zero. How about that, Mr. "Conservation of Mass"? And it was Antoine-Laurent de Lavoisier who formulated the 'law' in the late 1700s, not Newton 80 years before.



Your second claim, even it it was true which it almost certainly is not, is caused by spontaneous remissions. They are not frequent but they are well known to happen. The late Mrs. G Peters of Australia, who survived an extra five years with ovarian cancers. I knew her.



From an optical engineering point of view the human eye is a very poor "design". The eyes of squid and octopus are laid out better. So how come your designer got it right once but wrong the next time? Don't give me that human eye story again, I already know it better than you do.



Now, do you want to tell me about "Lucy", or Piltdown Man, the Nebraska tooth or Eugene Dubois. How about the peppered moths? Bombardier beetle? Second law of thermodynamics? Velocity of light?



Your arguments are old, tired, boring, worthless and your facts are false. We've seen them all before.



1/10. Must do better.
?
2012-08-02 06:39:26 UTC
1: Wrong - mass can be converted into energy and vice versa. Therefore the matter currently in the universe could originally have been various forms of energy.



2: You're simply misunderstanding the concept of probability. If someone has a low chance of survival it doesn't mean they will definitely not survive, it just means that statistically it is not very likely. There is a 1 in 15 million chance that you will win the lottery, but someone still wins it every week. Personally, I doubt any doctor said to your aunt "You have a 0% chance of survival" - they would have had to qualify the statement with a time period for one thing.



3: Thats just an opinion. Yes life did randomly appear for the same reason that other processes happen randomly. The fact that certain species are more capable of surviving meant that they developed over may millions of years and evolved into what we are today. In any case, who says that the human eye is complex? By human standards it may seem that way, but its all relative. You might think that particle physics is complicated, but to a trained particle physicist it isn't.



Anyway, why are you so worried? If you believe in god, then fine - believe in god - enjoy! Why does the fact that others may not believe in it bother you?
Pyriform
2012-08-02 06:17:03 UTC
"Newton's Law of conservation of mass..."

Lavoisier's, actually. And we now know that mass can be converted to and from other forms of energy. The energy may have existed since the beginning of time and so never have been created.



"Miracles happen every day. My aunt went to the hospital with a severe form of cancer and was given a 0% chance of survival"

Cancer sometimes goes into remission spontaneously. If the doctors really gave her a 0% chance of survival then they were just wrong.



"Life without God is purposeless."

We create our own purpose in life. God is not suddenly going to pop into existence just because you feel there is a higher purpose.



"Even if you do, do you really believe that something as complex as the human eye could just form by chance, with no intervention whatsoever?"

No. It formed by the process of evolution, which includes natural selection, which is definitely not just chance. We can see many stages which could have led to the development of the eye in nature today.
?
2012-08-02 09:48:57 UTC
Evolution created the human eye which in all honesty is not that complex compared to others in nature for instance a hawk or eagle has 10x the range of site then any human, or how about your average salt water crocodile that can litteraly move its liver within its body to adjust that angle at which it floats so as to only reveal the top of its head. Did you know that crocodiles and alligators also have a much more complex heart then that of humans....and a miracle is simple chance, of course a few people with a supposed 0% chance of survival are going to survive. That 0% was an educated guess on behalf of the physician or team of physicians. You obviously also dont understand the big bang theory of a super dence particle(supposedly the god particle) errupting and expanding becoming the universe not saying its true ut the theory is solid or it wouldnt be so mainstream. And honestly life is purposeless, if you think about it we are more of an inconvenience to this planet, all together we are the problem as most of the global problems we face are products of our own design. If the human race went extinct nothing would change, stars would still be born and die out planets will continue to change and reform through massive astrological events the vast majority of us couldnt begin to comprehend. We are as insignificant to the universe as one ant hill is to this entire nation. Get over yourself your no more special then me or your neighbor no more special then the poor squirrel I hit with my car last year. We are animals a happen stants of the right conditions at the right time, which ultimately was inevidible considers the size and age of the known universe. Chance is the only truth.
Ricardo
2012-08-02 08:24:58 UTC
1. Newton's Law of conservation of mass states that no matter can be created or destroyed. That means that any matter currently in the universe must have either existed forever or been created by an omnipotent God.



- You just said that matter/energy cannot be created or destroyed. So which is it. Is that real or is magic real.



2. Miracles happen every day.



- Your opinion, nothing more.



3. Life without God is purposeless.



- Yours obviously is, but then you need to be lead around by the nose and are incapable of actual thought.
VeggieTart -- Let's Go Caps!
2012-08-02 06:28:03 UTC
1) Just because we don't know all the answers doesn't mean a god created it. Stephen Hawking determined that a god was not necessary for the creation of the universe. I'm going to listen to a foremost physicist more than I will some goofball online.



2) People beat the odds all the time. Doctors have also determined that a positive attitude can go a long way in healing from dread illnesses. Your aunt is one of the lucky ones. Good for her.



3) That's an opinion and hardly proof of anything. Our bodies adapted to survive in this environment until humans learned to adapt the environment.



And even if there is a god--which is a pretty big if--how do you know YOUR god is the right one? After all, humans have invented thousands.



But if you want me to convert, I could worship Zeus and the other Greek gods; they're slightly less douchey than the god of the bible.
The Arbiter of common sense
2012-08-02 06:08:15 UTC
It is so sad when someone comes on here and displays their lack of knowledge in such a blatant way. Those 'proofs' are so wrong that it is not even worth giving details. But let's try:



1) Argument from ignorance. You are grossly misunderstanding Newton. But nevertheless, that you or even scientists do not fully understand the origins of the universe in way 'proves' the existence of a magical being.



2) I do not believe that doctors said 0% chance, but if thy did, they were wrong. That proves nothing other than their error. People have spontaneous remission every day, and prayer has never been show to have any impact on that.



3) this is a philosophical statement. Yes, i do believe that complex structures can form without intervention, or at least without intervention other than that of environmental selection. Educate yourself in the process and you'll be a better person.
anonymousPerson
2012-08-02 06:12:57 UTC
"Since atheists admit that the universe is finite, then it must be the latter."

false



"Despite that, she kept praying everyday [sic] and managed to survive the catastrophic disease, even when the doctor's hope was futile."

Assuming I believe you, just because the human body kicks ***, doesn't mean yourgoddidit.



Make your own purpose, yes, and yes; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W96AJ0ChboU explains how the eye could have evolved
?
2012-08-02 06:07:42 UTC
1. the law only apply in a closed system, we dont even know if the energy of the big bang came from another dimension or another universe, you are just assuming facts that are convenient for you



2. doctors are not infallible, even when the outcome is positive



3. purpose is a human concept, no we did not randomly appear on earth it is the results of natural occuring , btw the eye evolve, you can see transitional organs on other animals coming from very simple light sensitive organs up to the complex eyes of some birds,
Nous
2012-08-02 07:06:55 UTC
The only way primitive religion exists today is through the child abuse of forcing it into very, very young children but thanks to better education and growing intellects so many teens are able to discover the truth, throw off the indoctrination and step into the real world!



Academia states that in the absence of any sort of evidence of the existence of something it must be deemed not to exist until verifiable evidence is found - thus god is held not to exist pending some sort of verifiable evidence.



The bible is what is called "Faction" A fictional story set in a factual time and place. Thus the time, place and real historical characters are all correct but the fictional characters and stories are not!



There is not one single mention of Jesus in the entire Roman record - that is right - not one! At the same time as he was supposed to have been around there were a number of Jews claiming to be the messiah - all of whom are well recorded!



There is not a single contemporary record from any source and even the bible mentions of him like all other references were not written until many years after his supposed death!



He was supposed to have been a huge problem to the Romans and produced wonderful miracles but still not one contemporary record?



Even the bible mentions of him like all other references were not written until many years after his supposed death!



Pilate is recorded in the Roman record as a somewhat lack luster man but no mention of a Jesus, a trial or crucifixion that would surely have been used to make him look brighter!



At best he was an amalgam of those others but almost certainly never existed!



The Roman Emperor Constantine produced the bible and he was a pagan not god! He took the Jewish religion, organized it into Christianity and then into the Holly Roman Catholic Church!! Not in Israel or any of the countries of supposed origin but entirely ITALIAN!



Not one word of it is contemporary with the period and was not written until several hundred years after the period the story is set in!! How did the apostles write their books more than a hundred years after they would have been dead?



What a wonder full disinformation and deception campaign he waged against his Jewish enemies by turning them into his invented Christianity - so good in fact that Christians are still following the deception to this day!



The first person to provide a shred of verifiable evidence for God will become world famous and mega rich! Ain't happened yet and it never will!



So how does this primitive belief in a god survive? The answer is simple and very down to Earth



Acceptance of a supernatural claim tends to promote cooperative social relationships. This communication demonstrates a willingness to accept, without skepticism, the influence of the speaker in a way similar to a child's acceptance of the influence of a parent. By encouraging this kind of behavior where the most intense social relationships occur it facilitates the lack of skepticism and deters more open minded thinking.



They are christian, Muslim or the other religions depending where they were born simply because they were indoctrinated by their parents as very young children. They will go on to indoctrinate their own children and those will go on to indoctrinate their grandchildren!



Atheists have the intellect to see through the conditioning and escape into the real world!



Agnostics have the intellect to see through the conditioning but lack the courage to throw of the conditioning entirely.



Sadly Christians, muslims and others are still held firmly prisoner by the self perpetuating brainwashing!
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:14:09 UTC
1. I don't think the definition of Atheist is - A person who admits the Universe is finite.



2. Prove that your Aunts case is not more than a doctors miscalculation, or a freak occurrence.



3. I see no evidence to suggest that any supreme being has done anything.



Loosen your sphincter muscles so that you can get oxygen to your brain.
David Rea
2012-08-02 06:04:36 UTC
None of that is any evidence for your god.



1. We don't know for sure the exact answer, that doesn't mean god did it.



2. Unlikely things happen every day. To think that it's a miracle;

a) underestimates the amount of things that happen

b) is incredibly egotistical. To think that the one unlikely thing is evidence of a loving god you have to ignore the billions suffering every day and the millions per year that do die of the same disease.



3) " Do you really think we just randomly appeared here for no reason? "



No I don't, please leave your strawman at the door.



As for the evolution of the eye... It's a fairly well understood idea.
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:06:44 UTC
1- Has nothing to do with a God....but it breaks in quantum mechanics anyhow. Most physical laws do. But even if it didn't that would mean the mass was eternal, not a god.



2- Bull



3- Bull



Let's see, two outright lies and one blatant misstatement of a law of physics. How you gonna prove a god again?
Zombie Crazyfool
2012-08-02 06:04:26 UTC
1.Stephen Hawking already has a hypothesis about how the universe could had came from nothing.

2.Was it a supernatural event?No.So it's not a miracle,it was simply your aunt beating the odds.

3.How is life without god purposeless if life with god means paradise waiting for you after life?
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:07:54 UTC
Matthew, think about this. Since the bible says to have faith in God and faith means trust or belief without proof, then if someone was able to somehow come up with a widely accepted proof, would that not destroy faith itself?
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:07:12 UTC
1/ Fallacy.



2/ Lie.



3/ The Eye is designed badly and has an unused evolutionary eyelid that you probably didn't know about.





Usual stuff.
person
2012-08-02 06:09:01 UTC
If you had real proof, they would claim it's fake.



If God allowed someone to rise from the dead to witness to them, they would say it's a medical mystery and the man is insane.



If they saw God in a dream, they would say it's just a dream or they would think they're insane.



It doesn't matter what it is, atheists wont believe no matter what the case is. It's because they're unable to believe. They cast aside the forgiveness of sins from Jesus Christ because they love sin and so "claiming to be wise, they became fools" (Romans 1:22)



But it's not as if there is no hope, because as long as they live, they need only repent and know that Christ has taken away all their sin. That's all it takes, thanks be to God.
?
2012-08-02 06:04:26 UTC
Nope. You failed miserably. Go back to school for your remedial studies.
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:05:49 UTC
No. Sorry you hilariously failed. Go back to elementary school, before you answer that.
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:03:50 UTC
Sorry, no conversion here





...and I think you have a problem with what the definition of "proof" is.
?
2012-08-02 06:05:45 UTC
This question should be closed, because it is not constructive.
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:04:30 UTC
Still not believing it.
anonymous
2012-08-02 06:04:23 UTC
lying for jesus is still lying
?
2012-08-02 06:05:01 UTC
head/desk/head/desk/head/desk


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