Did the universe come from nothing and can nothing create something: or is there a God?

Question

"Speaking to a sold out crowd at the Berkeley Physics Oppenheimer Lecture, Hawking said yesterday that he now believes the universe spontaneously popped into existence from nothing. He said more work is needed to prove this but we have time because 'Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.'

Again I ask, what is easier to believe that the universe came from nothing and that something can come from nothing, or that God existed prior to the universe and is the Creator of it?

It seems to me that the Atheists position is far more unreasonable then the position that God created all that is.

The quote above came from http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?no_d2=1&sid=07/03/14/172226

Susanna Member since:
May 26, 2010 response is posted below

"I am a Christian and.....
IF a cube of solid bronze would suddenly appear out of thin air......
and IF that cube turned into a giant squid......
and IF that squid grew wings and flew away...
Then I would believe.
That is IF i could convince myself I was not hallucinating."

My response: No reasonable person would accept the creation of something without a cause and thus science exists. Seems stupid to believe that something can come from nothing and yet deny its possibility in the realities of every day life. To say there is no God = insanity.

Anyone have any reasonable thoughts on this matter: or do we just have you Atheists to hear from? My last question is a joke: lighten up.

Answer 1

If there was no God to create the universe and matter were truly eternal, then we could not be here at all, because you can not traverse an eternal line and get to here. If it is truly eternal then there is an infinite amount of days before here.

Answer 2

I don't see how that is unreasonable; Hawking's idea is a hypothesis, not a theory, as it has yet to be validated by evidence. However, it is potentially compatible with our current level of understanding of quantum physics, where matter can indeed come from nothing, albeit with certain restrictions. Be careful; he's not implied that this happened at one time, as time itself is just a property of the universe. More that existence itself is a state of nature, and fluctuates between 0 and 1 at the quantum level. It's the sum of properties that is zero, but an 'unbalancing' of zero can lead to equal positive and negative properties, e.g. matter and antimatter. Energy itself is likely to be a property that sums to zero. The universe has indications of being much more multi-dimensional than our 4-d space-time, and indeed other time-like dimensions may exist. As we know that virtual particles can come into existence from nothing, it's not inconceivable that our physical universe is just a larger scale version of the same phenomenon, and that al the properties within it (or possible corresponding multiverses) still sum to zero. In a way, matter is just an unbalancing of nothingness. So while we cannot say this is the case, it's certainly conceivable, and is consistent with what limited evidence we have so far. This contrasts with the idea of a god, which is supported by absolutely no evidence at all. There's not even any formal hypothesis of a god, as nobody is coming up with any precise, formal definition of what a god actually is. Remember; the Universe is the 'everything' - it *includes* any gods that exist. While some will argue that a god can create a physical universe, that's only a subset of the total; it avoids asking the bigger question: why does this totality (including any gods) exist? Hence any god idea doesn't actually even *try* answer the question of why the 'everything' exists anyway, while quantum physics does. Trying to answer the question completely, using evidence, is more reasonable than deliberately avoiding part of it and using a zero-evidence presumption. Edit: @The_doc_man: You're quite right about those hypotheses (M-theory, colliding branes) in terms of explaining our physical universe, with possible precursors or non-temporal states of phase. However, it's still a valid question to ask: why isn't there nothing? What is the nature of existence? I feel that quantum physics is still the closest to getting to the nub of that one, and the virtual particles ideas is a big clue. It seems that Hawking is more trying to address that than a more localised explanation of our physical 'big banged' universe which may indeed be a subset of a greater maximal Universe. In any case, the approach to understanding this must be based on evidence, otherwise we cannot tell the diference between any idea being valid and invalid. Hence we don't jump to conclusions, e.g. gods.

Answer 3

As a matter of fact, in the statement: "In the beginning God created the Heaven and the Earth,” the word "Barah" is used which means "to create out of nothing." In the original Greek we have "pro chronon aionion" or" before time eternal." In Titus 1:2 it states "that hope that we have in Jesus Christ was given to us before the beginning of time.” Another verse of scripture is: "The grace of God that we now experience was put into effect before the BEGINNING OF TIME" (2Timothy 1:9). Again, in this passage the same three Greek words are used!! There are eight places in the Bible which state that God created time.



Many false teachers, bogus scientists and philosophers have also said that the universe always existed or that it is self-existent? Another false

assertion was that is was created ExNihlo independently of God. Again, nothing by and of itself brings forth nothing - except when God intervenes.



Proving this was the Hubble telescope which was launched in space in 1990. For the first time this powerful instrument saw to the edge of the universe which is about 13.7 billion light years away . It was an incredible discovery for this is saying that the universe is limited or finite. It is not as infinite as we all thought. According to Einstein: "...if the universe has a beginning, it must have a beginner, hence the existence of God.".

Even Stephen Hawking, the modern Einstein of our day, confirmed that time had to be created! The Bible also states in Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning, God created the Heavens and the Earth." That means everything in the Cosmos. 15

Answer 4

Yet you believe that a god could come into being from nothing. Odd. And you don't even see that you're performing the same mental gymnastics you claim make a natural origin of the universe impossible.



I think it's much easier to believe that matter and energy always existed than to believe that an infinitely powerful entity capable of speaking matter and energy into existence from nothing always existed. If the universe is too complex to exist without being created, surely an infinitely more complex god is also too complex to exist without being created.

Answer 5

Imagine 2 soap bubbles. They are 3 dimensional bodies. Where they intersect a 2 dimensional disc appears "out of nothing"!



Now add one dimension (or 2 since the 4th dimension isn't really a dimension rather a direction).



Then it's not impossible to think of our universe coming "out of nothing" as a result of two intersecting 5 dimensional universes. No creation needed.



You ask where the 5 dimensional universes come from? Add more dimensions and let them intersect and so on and so on. No creation needed.



"No reasonable person would accept the creation of something without a cause". Well then consider not accepting it because god created time according to the book of Genesis.



At what time he decided to create then? Without time no before and after, no cause and effect. No way to tell what isn't there now and has to be created later. No decision - no creation - no creator.



QED

That was easy, next one.

Answer 6

There are those who would tell you: There was a beginning, but there was also a beginning before that beginning. There was a beginning previous to that beginning before there was the beginning. There was existence where there had been no existence. There was no existence before the beginning of that no existence. There was no existence previous to the no existence before there was the beginning of no existence. If suddenly there was non-existence, we do not know whether there was really anything existing, or really not existing, or whether I am really here or not really here. Or indeed whether 'something' came from 'nothing' and whether God was before the 'nothing' and produced the 'something.'

Answer 7

I'm an atheist. I don't think the universe came from nothing. Eventually, we will have a solid, evidence-backed answer. Just because we don't know right now, doesn't mean that a god exists.

Answer 8

Energy cannot be created or destroyed, enregy has always existed and the matter you are, are just dense energy. No need for an imaginary friend called god, the universe is the alpha and omega.





energy...

Answer 9

First of all, so where did God come from?



Second, something can come from nothing, assuming there is an equal amount of something to counteract the nothing.



For example: 0=0

However, this is also true: 0=1-1

Answer 10

Actually, something can come from nothing. On an extremely small scale, matter is constantly popping in and out of existence. There is no net change, because it almost instantly disappears, but it did come "from nothing."

Answer 11

"To say there is no God = insanity."



Hmm... That depends on what you want to believe. Something has to always existed, so what sounds more reasonable, the universe expanding or there having always been some random God dude hanging out and then deciding to make the universe?

Answer 12

Funny thing is though, the God you posit had to create everything from nothing ... so how does that change anything?

Answer 13

For something to come from nothing, there has to be a sufficient reason.



Without the principle of sufficient reason, things would be popping in and out of existence all the time completely randomly.









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Answer 14

You are right we should not accept that something came from nothing, we need a god to give us - something from nothing - but then something can't come from nothing, but god created something from nothing, but something can't come from nothing, oh sh*t, now you've got me confused. Which is it, did something come from nothing or did something come from nothing.

Answer 15

I think Stephen Hawking knows more about the subject than you ever will

Answer 16

Your quote - had you really checked it - is from someone with the screen name of scuttlemonkey. After I checked that out, I dismissed the rest of your rant.

Answer 17

So what created god? Or did he come from nothing? Oh dear, your argument doesn't seem to work, does it?