Pro-choice people I need help?

Question

Ok so I've always been pro-choice but now in my Catholic School (I'm Irish but not Catholic) we've been discussing it in religion and it's starting to turn me... but obviously it's very biased in my school, can an intelligent pro-choice person (preferably an adult mother) give me their side. The only thing I can think of against it at the moment is that it's not aware of itself, but my dog is apparently not aware of herself and I don't think that really would justify killing her. Also we've had a guest speaker who was concieved of rape and is pro-life..

Answer 1

You know, I'm really not comfortable with people having abortions just because they knowingly took a chance on getting pregnant and then ended up pregnant and it wasn't convenient. However, I remain just this side of pro-choice because I think there are tragic situations where a woman or girl could end up pregnant and should not be forced to carry the baby to term because she is not really responsible for the pregnancy. Eg. she was raped/ molested. Sure, it would be noble of her to carry the baby to term anyway, but just like you wouldn't force somebody to donate a kidney to a stranger who needs it, you shouldn't force a woman to lend her body as an incubator for a baby she didn't ask for. Pregnancy and childbirth are a big deal, mentally and physically.



Some people might say ok, let's just make an exception for women and girls who were raped or molested then. The trouble is, these things are often impossible to prove, which is why conviction rates for rape are so low. Should a woman also have to prove she was raped or molested to get an abortion? What if it happened in private and there are no witnesses? Should we just believe her? And if we simply believe anybody who says she was raped and give her an exception, then any woman could claim to have been raped in order get an abortion, so what would be the point of having a law against it?



So that is why I think it should be a choice. I'd like to see advances in birth control technology and more people taking more responsibility for preventing unwanted pregnancies, so that less of them happen. I'd like to see a culture where a woman or girl who finds herself pregnant by accident in spite of reasonable efforts at prevention is supported if she chooses to have the baby, instead of scorned and given a hard time. I'd like to see a culture where people think twice about having sex with someone they don't feel they could stand to cooperate with for the next 18 yrs to raise a child. But a law to force a woman to carry a baby to term whether she likes it or not? No.



And for what it is worth, I am an adult mother. And I'm not Catholic, in case you hadn't guessed. :-)

Answer 2

You said you are not catholic, so let me start by saying: don't take the catholic religion literally, its good to learn, but better to learn (both sides of the story), make your own decisions, and come to your own conclusions.

In a situation like this there is no right or wrong answer. It is (well, should be) a matter of personal choice. I also went to catholic school and was told about how wrong abortion is, while being shown very graphic movies.

There will always be people who are pro choice, and who are pro life. What it ultimately comes down to is that women should be given the option to abort if they so desire. Remember, one of the main principles the USA is based on, is the separation of church and state. Abortion is an issue of the church, that has been imposed on the government. They are two separate entities, and should have no say in what each other does. Whether the church says its good or evil, should be completely irrelevant. The church will always say its evil, and you will not win the argument by yourself, because they wont see it any other way.

Answer 3

I guess my big thing is that the government shouldn't even be involved in legislating abortions period. (With the exception of live birth abortion). Up until the point where a fetus is viable, it should be the mother's choice period. It should not be a legal issue. Once the fetus is viable, however, that should be against the law.



You can be morally opposed to abortion as I am, while agreeing that government has no place to dictate morality.



Furthermore, I have extremely high risk pregnancies. I have 3 children of my own and my doctor has absolutely told me not to have any more biological children. Getting pregnant for me means, at the very least, a very lengthy hospital stay. At the worst, I could die. If I were to be raped and get pregnant, I would strongly consider abortion. Why would I choose the life of an unviable fetus over my life as well as the happiness and well being of my family? For me personally, that would be something that would require a great deal of counsel with my religious leaders as well as prayer and fasting on my part. BUT I would at least like the choice. And I think I have the right to choose to protect my life.

Answer 4

The issue is not whether its human, or whether its living. The issue is when the fetus should be considered a person for the purposes of overriding the woman's right to withdraw her consent to having it in her body. Your dog has much more consciousness than a fetus up to a certain point, yet we have no problem killing millions of animals for food with equal amounts of consciousness. Certainly, the "pro-life" movement isn't protesting outside of factory farms.



Now, we can debate exactly when the fetus should be considered a person, but we must first agree that abortion should be legal. Otherwise any "pro-life" person will be arguing in bad faith.



edit: The "it has unique genes so it is a person" argument is flawed in this way: the genes are just a blueprint. As you know, having a set of blueprints is not the same thing as having the whole house. Personhood depends on having the house or a substantial portion of it.

Answer 5

"Choice" is personal. It regards the ENTIRE life of the mother and future child (imho), not only the actual "first breath of life". I am an adult mother (22 yr old daughter). I had 2 abortions before the birth of my child and 1 after. MY choice for the abortions centered around many things: my age at the time of each terminated pregnancy, where my financial life was then, how my romantic relationship was with the father (boyfriend for 2/husband for 1, same man for all 4 pregnancies) and how much "motherhood" I was willing to devote to a child. It sounds so caring and concerned to hear people speak about "Pro-Life" when a woman is pregnant. When that same woman has to get on welfare to SUPPORT the precious life of that child though, these same people start preaching an entirely different thing, don't they?

Answer 6

Sometimes there are very serious complications in a pregnancy that can cause a child to be seriously deformed. A friend of mine gave birth to a baby without a brain stem. The child was blind, deaf and did not have a functioning brain. She lived for a year as a complete vegetable. The mother was sorry she didn't abort this poor suffering child. Also, there are situations where giving birth could kill the mother. Women with severe heart problems or diabetes are in danger of dying if they carry a child to full term. There are parents with hereditary diseases that could pass them on to a child. Would you want to have a child with schizophrenia or a disease that will be painful and shorten his life?



I am sorry that your school is brainwashing kids about choice. No one has the right to force his religious views on anyone else and that includes the right to make choices about her own body.

Answer 7

OK look at it this way: Pro Choice denotes CHOICE NOT advocating abortion merely supporting a woman;'s right to CHOOSE; Anti abortion is totally dictatorial and no one who is anti abortion does anything to support their POV, they never adopt unwanted children already here they do not volunteer their time to help them and they do not give money for their care, they only care about the fetus while it's still in the womb, once it is born they could care less what happens to it...and then you have rape, incest, birth defects such as anencpehlay where ti is hopeless for the fetus to have any life at all. Do more research before you decide, and visit abused shelters for unwanted kids that have almost been murdered because they were unwanted in the first place.

Answer 8

this is what I think it comes down to education



there is more than just life or death for the fetus



there is also adoption which can either be open (where you can have a part in the child's life) or closed (where you are not know by the child).



I grew up pro-choice but am more pro-life now, but what I think it comes down to is the fact that ever person as the right to choose, but within that choice they should have all the resources possible. They should not feel forced by anybody, professional or family, they should not leave with questions, they should feel confident about their decision.



Like I said before I think it comes back to education. while what happens to the infant is gross and disgusting and wrong in the end I am to support the person who made the choice to abort their child.





http://www.abortionfacts.com/

Answer 9

professional decision. i do no longer precisely approve abortion as a ethical decision, yet i think of that if a girl needs to get an abortion, she could have each and every outstanding to. i might in no way get one myself till there replaced right into a controversy which could be risky to me and/or the little one (which includes ectopic being pregnant) or if I have been ever raped (God forbid). I additionally think of that no count what the regulation says, surely everyone seems to be usually going to opt for abortions. i might lots truly have those people get their abortions carried out in a sparkling enviroment by skill of a doctor who's familiar with what the hell they are doing than in some back alley with a coat hanger.

Answer 10

Interesting that you only asked Pro-choice people to respond to this question. You knew that they would agree with you. However, I will answer your question from the other side, the side that believes that life begins at conception- no matter the circumstances behind the conception. Granted rape is horrible- however why would the baby deserve the death penalty? You are saying that a baby in the womb, is not aware of itself? How do you know that? When does life begin to you? There was a surgery done on a baby in the womb, and that baby lifted his hands out of the womb and touched the doctor's hand. Look it up on google it is there- it happened. Even if you are not religious, look at the facts. You show me where science tells us that life begins any other time but at conception, it doesn't. And if you were very sure what you believed, you would not be doubting that belief.

EDIT- you are saying that a baby is alive just like a plant? You are living in denial my friend. I knew that this would get thumbs down, but I will stand up for truth no matter how much I get criticized.

Answer 11

I am an ex-Catholic, but I found a group of Catholics that show some incredible depth of thought on this matter. I encourage you to visit Catholics United to see what they have to say. I also wrote about them on my blog site.



By the way, I believe that your dog does have self-awareness. Maybe not in the same way that we humans do.

Answer 12

The thing is that once the father genes get together with the mother genes it is already an specific human being, so killing it is murder, there is no question about that, what society has to decide is what types of murder it accepts, for example capital punishment, self defense, wars, collateral damage, etc. To me the only case in which abortion should be allowed is when the mother is going to die, and that could actually fall in self defense also. But hey people are killed everyday in so many ways, that nothing surprises me.

Answer 13

You need to study The Word Of God, not what they fill you with that is of Rome!!

Between the 320's and late 1500's, the Holy Roman Empire killed of the majority of the true followers of the gospels of Jesus Christ.

As to your question, read and study, then for yourself you will know in your heart, it states I knew you before the foundations of the earth.

So, God is telling you that He knows of every rape, molestation, etc., and if the woman conceives from this, God already knows, and has a plan . No where in the Word of God does it give consent to abortion..

But, as I said, do your own study, then you will have The Word in your heart.

Answer 14

I was unaware you needed to be able to "justify" what someone else does with her own body. I think women who get pregnant as a result of voluntary sexual action should take responsibility for the actions, but it's none of the government's business, and you can't force women to be incubators (and maintain your own integrity, at least). Proclaiming oneself "pro-life" while enslaving women to one's own moral whims is a hopelessly corrupt position.

Answer 15

The root of this question is "is a fetus a human being?"

Thus, making it murder to have an abortion.

If a fetus is a human being, do we count them on the census?





Listen to George Carlin talk about it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrXvDXVhqfU

Answer 16

Yes, abortion is wrong. The Lord has said, "You shall not murder," (Exodus 20:13). The life that is growing within the mother is a child, a baby. The Bible looks at the life in the womb as a child.: Exodus 21:22 says, "And if men struggle with each other and strike a woman with child so that she has a miscarriage, yet there is no further injury, he shall surely be fined as the woman's husband may demand of him; and he shall pay as the judges decide,"(1) (NASB).

The main concern of the "Pro-Choicers" is not the guarded protection of the life in the womb. Instead, the main concern is the "rights" of the mother over and against the rights of the child growing in her. The child, who cannot exercise its own will, is killed. And, in order to make the killing more palatable, the baby is called a "fetus", or "non-viable", or "not yet human", etc. This eases the conscience. But, for those who say the baby isn't 'viable', have you ever seen a sonogram of an abortion? You can see the 'non-viable fetus' retracting from the instruments of death and seeking self preservation. It wants to live. Some would respond by saying that even a rodent wants to live. But what is in the womb of the mother is human.

The Bible says for people to protect the weak and down trodden. But with abortionists, the rights of the baby are sacrificed to the rights of the mother -- and the father doesn't even have any rights. The mother cries out that the life in here is part of her body and that she has the right to do with her body as she wills.

True love does not seeks its own, but is other centered. It gives. "For God so loved the world he GAVE his only begotten son..." (John 3:16). Abortion is the ultimate in selfishness. It puts the mother's convenience and desires above the life of her own baby. To kill the baby in the womb means to consider oneself more important than anyone else.

Even in nature, as far as I understand, animals don't kill what is in their own wombs. People are the only ones who kill their young while still unborn. In this society of "self esteem," "personal accomplishments," and "empowerment," true love is losing out and death is winning.

However, there is hope in Jesus. If you've had an abortion, you can be forgiven by the Lord. All you need to do is confess it to the Lord Jesus and ask Him to forgive you. That is what I did years ago when the girl I lived with became pregnant and had an abortion. I was guilty. As a man, the inner turmoil and guilt I felt was horrible. I can't imagine what it would be life for a woman. Nevertheless, the Lord has graciously forgiven me and her. I say this only in the hopes that others would come to find the sweet forgiveness found in Jesus.

Nevertheless, the unbeliever is not convicted by the words of God. So, I've presented what I consider a logical argument against abortion.

http://www.carm.org/questions/abortion.htm

Answer 17

Personally, I see no difference between it and, ahem, "Protection." Still, it seems a bit unethical to me anyways, but I consider it the lesser of two evils.

Answer 18

"Remember, "god" is nothing more than a nonsense word created by man to explain away all of the things we can't yet understand.



Religion is a disease of the mind, born of fear, which has done nothing but bring untold misery down upon the human race. "



I know that if we use logic and reason that the statement above will eventually be considered a fact in our society. I really do long for the day that i will see all religion done away with and the human race can advance beyond thinking this imaginary floating being controls everything.





Don't you wish the whole world was this intelligent?



Satan is or was an angel according to the Book of lies(The holy Bible) so if he existed with god for thousands if not millions of years before mankind doesn't that make him alot smarter then us, and if so and the most beautiful angel in heaven would turn against god, then doesn't he know something we dont?



If you look at the bible satan is the one who told us to eat the fruit so that we may know right from wrong, if we didn't know right from wrong before then why are we being punished for sinning, god at that point didn't give us the power to determine what was good or evil. So we ate the fruit and now we know can know good and evil but now its to late?



doesn't seem right to me.



Am i wrong to say that if not for satan we would all be like robots not knowing good from evil and basically being like animals? wouldn't we sin without knowing it anyway if we didn't know what was bad?



Common sense will tell you that with some many world religions that you believe are "wrong" that you religion is probably also WRONG.



Let me break this down for you... You need a way to control people and they are all wondering what will happen when they die and wondering why they die and how they got here so you make up some rules and tell them that "god" told you this, then you tell them that they will go to hell if they don't obey those rules but if they do Obey they will go to heaven.



So the unintelligent people who know nothing of science and have no common sense follow this false snare to get them to obey these laws, the problem is that their children and grand children also believe this bull and now its gotten so bad that people cant tell the difference between reality and these myths.



Greeks really believed in Apollo.



Romans REALLY believed in Saturn.



Christians REALLY believed in christ, but i hope very soon, the world will see it as it is. Just another Myth.

Answer 19

how could you live when over population eats you out of your food and house? look how well disease gets spread even to unwanted death. see, that is what abstinence teaches. some protectionn is better than none.

Answer 20

Cancerous tumors are a living "gift from god" too, it's funny you don't see the Christians insisting on keeping these alive, but it wouldn't surprise me to see them start.

Answer 21

You can't respect a woman's right, since it is her body.



Maybe you will dedicate your life to raises all those babies.



No, a fetus is not a baby.

Answer 22

So you are starting to change your mind about choice. This scares you and you want to do anything you can not to change. They call me close minded. Perhaps you are changing because there are no intelligent answers to why we abort living beings.

Answer 23

You could bring your mom to the school and speak of how she could have had an abortion and killed you before you were born.



But that wouldn't help your argument much though, sorry.

Answer 24

a) Fetuses ≠ People



b) Womans body, her right what to do with it



No law should violate anyones right to do what they choose with their body