Question:
Is it cool to be anti-mary?
2008-07-22 12:04:23 UTC
Among women she was blessed, but I just don't like it going past that, I cringe at that name. Why can't Paul be put up there with Mary, or even higher than Mary?

But anyway, is it ok to be anti-mary in the sense that she was blessed and nothing more, no honor given, no name mentioned in prayer?
36 answers:
Sentinel
2008-07-26 10:33:09 UTC
Paul was a sinner,Mary was not(Immaculately concieved)

Mary is the new Eve as Jesus is the new Adam, Mary`s Yes to God brought down to us the Savior, need I go on?
2008-07-22 14:18:33 UTC
"Anti-Mary"? That's unusual coming from a non-Catholic. At least it's refreshingly honest admission of a "Maryallergy".



But as far as it being cool ... no, I think it's rather sad to be "anti", or against, the mother of our Lord. What did she ever do to you? Other than say "yes" to God, and give birth to the Savior of your soul, that is.



You guys will never get it. The honor given to Mary isn't due to anything she did or was in her own right, but the amazing and wonderful thing God did through her.



If you are so much more fond of Paul, remember that he did nothing in his own strength either, but only through Christ in him.



Now tell me, my friend: What, exactly, is the difference?



Other than the fact that Paul wrote a lot of letters for you to read, that is, and "all" Mary said was "do whatever he tells you"?
Maya
2008-07-22 13:05:53 UTC
No, I don't think so. First of all, why should Paul be up there or even higher than Mary?? I mean, why him?? I believe in honoring the Virgin Mary. She was chosen as the holy vessel to bring God's only son into the world. How much more blessed can you be?? I also believe she is able to intercede to God on your behalf. I mean, if your gonna ask anyone to help you pray to God, who better than his own mother? I can see why one would think that we are worshiping other "Gods" when one mentions praying to the Virgin Mary (which I do, I pray the rosary regularly) or when praying to a saint or even one of the archangels. But the way I see it, your not praying TO THEM you are asking for them to INTERCEDE to God on your behalf for whatever blessings or help or whatever it is you may be needing. I believe in the power of prayer and the more you have praying for you the better. Also, remember, she is the mother of God's only son, and if He honors her, why shouldn't you??
Dan
2008-07-23 14:05:55 UTC
Think of Mary as the New Ark of the Covenant. In the OT the Ark of the Covenant carried the law of God in the tablets, the staff of Aaron the priest. The OT ark was considered very holy and was treasured and kept in a holy place. Mary contained not the law of God but the fulfillment of the law in Jesus, she contained not the staff of a priest but the ultimate high priest in Jesus Christ. As the OT ark was highly valued and treasured so should the NT ark which is Mary. Look at these parallels from Scripture.

In 2 Samuel 6:9 David says ""How can the ark of the LORD come to me?" In Luke 1:43 Elizabeth says of Mary "And how does this happen to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

In 2 Samuel 6:16 as the ark of the Lord comes we see "King David leaping and dancing before the LORD." In Luke 1:44 as Mary enters Elizabeth says "the infant in my womb leaped for joy. "

Mary is the ark of the New Covenant and thus she is highly valued. Bear in mind that the OT Jews did not WORSHIP the ark itself. They worshiped only God but valued the ark for what it carried in it. No idol worship there. Hello Protestants!

Catholics value highly the NT ark which is Mary but do not WORSHIP Mary only highly esteem her. No idol worship here either.

So the answer is no, it is not cool to be anti Mary or anti OT ark either.
2008-07-22 12:10:18 UTC
Well, first of all Paul didn't give birth to Jesus. Secondly, Paul never even met Jesus face to face. He wasn't even one of the original 12 disciples!



With all due respect, Paul is a johnny-come-lately in the world of Christianity...so why should he be elevated higher than the mother of Jesus? Do you show more respect to Joe Schmoe down the street than your own mother?



Well, you can do whatever you wish, but Mary will always be special and worthy of respect for me and for many other people worldwide such as Catholics (both Latin and Eastern Rite), Anglicans, Eastern Orthodox, some Methodists and Lutherans. Did you know that Islamics also recognize Mary (Maryam) as the mother of Jesus, and they believe in the Virgin Birth, too. She's mentioned in the Koran as well as in the Christian Bible. There are even some who are into New Age philosophies who revere Mary.



The veneration of Mary is an integral part of culture and the humanities. She has been the subject of great works of art, literature and music throughout the ages. People around the world of various faiths have claimed to seen apparitions of Her ... even to this day. So you really can't blow off Mary all that easily. She is established in the spiritual consciousness of many.



Why is She worthy of our admiration and veneration?



Because of the fact that she said yes to becoming the mother of Jesus. She said yes, taking a huge risk of being ostracized by her society for being quite young (somewhere between 13 and 16), unwed and pregnant....back in the days when an unwed pregnancy meant death by stoning! She took the risk that her betrothed, Joseph, would not believe her about this conception and walk out on her, too. Yet, in spite of all that, Mary STILL said yes, and followed the will of God and allowed herself to be used as a vessel to bring Jesus into the world to redeem it.



Salve Regina!



EDIT



Isn't there enough mysogyny in religion without having to show such a disregard and disrespect for Mary? So, no, it's NOT "cool." It's merely sad and insulting that you feel the need to take her down a notch or two in order to elevate another male religious figure...and seek our approval in order to do it!
Mama Kate
2008-07-26 10:33:30 UTC
She IS the Immaculate Conception. She gave birth to both Divinity and Humanity all the while keeping Herself pure and free of all sin. She is the Mother of God, Mary Most Holy, not above God, not worshiped, but revered and honored by those who love Her. With out Her there would have been no Christ. She was made the Most Pure and Perfect Vessel for our Divine Savior, She is above all except God in the Most High and Holy Trinity. We do not worship Her but adoringly love Her, our Mother, our Most Perfect Example of Humility and Peace.
Snow Globe
2008-07-22 12:32:42 UTC
The Mary issue will always be a bone of contention among believers, and it should be left to the conscience of the believer. Mary was a wonderful woman and we should emulate her trust and faithfulness. I don't agree with some of the opinions above, but I'm not going to split hairs over it. I will say, you do not ask people who are dead to pray for you. We need no intercession from anyone to the Lord.



Ex-Marine -- your typo-graphic is somewhat at odds with your statements, although it's cleverly-made.



Cross Crafter -- stop the cut and paste!
cashelmara
2008-07-26 10:23:50 UTC
The Magnificat , also called the Canticle of Mary, is recorded in the Gospel of Luke (1:46-55). It is the Virgin Mary's joyous prayer in response to her cousin Elizabeth's greeting (Luke 1: 41-45).



To love Mary takes nothing at all from Christ, but honors our Blessed Lord by Whose grace she is who she is.



Mary herself said at the beginning of St. Luke's gospel (1:48), when she prophesied under the Holy Spirit, "Behold, from now on all generations will call me blessed." That is a prophecy that has come true in the course of Christian history, and it is the basis of Marian devotion, for that is what we are doing when we honor and glorify Mary: we are calling her blessed on account of all the marvelous things God has done for her and all the glorious graces he has given her.



My soul magnifies the Lord,

And my spirit rejoices in God my Savior.

For He has regarded the low estate of His handmaiden,

For behold, henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.

For He who is mighty has done great things for me, and holy is His name. And His mercy is on those who fear Him from generation to generation.

He has shown strength with His arm:

He has scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts.

He has put down the mighty from their thrones,

and exalted those of low degree.

He has filled the hungry with good things;

and the rich He has sent empty away.

He has helped His servant Israel, in remembrance of His mercy;

As He spoke to our fathers, to Abraham and to His posterity forever.



Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.

As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen



Anyone who has been using passages to attack the Catholic view of Mary should seriously ask himself whether he cares more about finding verses against the Catholic position or about what Scripture really says and whether anti-Catholic prejudice has been blinding him to the real meaning of the Scriptures-here and elsewhere.
Stanbo
2008-07-22 12:12:30 UTC
Being the Mother of Jesus is an honor. God honored Mary by making her the mother of His Son. By honoring her we follow the example of God. Mary's special privileges were given to her by God, not man.



God bless,

Stanbo
Faye
2008-07-22 12:11:21 UTC
In my opinion, no, but being Catholic that is what I believe in. Mary was blessed among women because she was born without Original Sin and never sinned, and stayed pure.



Catholics don't worship Mary, we honor her as a mediator and intercessor for our prayers.
C
2008-07-22 12:11:46 UTC
Jesus honored her, the angles honored her, why should we not honor her?



Paul did not give birth to Jesus.



We don't worship Mary, but She is a great person to look up to, and her job is to lead us to her Son.



Do you get mad when others give honor to your Mother? Why then would Jesus?



Peace be with you.
milomax
2008-07-22 15:20:12 UTC
For someone who says he doesn't want attention placed on Mary, you certainly seem to be obsessed with her. Why is that? You also seem to be obsessed with Paul. Where is God in all of this? Jesus?
Sldgman
2008-07-22 12:39:30 UTC
When you PURPOSELY DENY honor to someone, you are purposely not loving someone. To purposely not love someone is to go against the great commandment that Jesus gave us - You shall love your God with all of your heart, mind and soul and your neighbor as yourself.



Please not that this is different from incidentally not honoring someone. I do not honor Garth Brooks (not a C&W Music fan), but I do not purposely deny him honor. He just is not in my CD collection.
paninja90
2008-07-22 12:36:49 UTC
Only if your not Catholic, they view her as a person born without original sin. so they think she is next on the ladder under Jesus. I personally agree with you, she was blessed but besides giving birth to Jesus what did she do for the Church. I also agree with you on Paul, enough that when I became catholic...sigh... I chose that as my name, he is after Jesus the most important member of the Church.
magnetic_azimuth
2008-07-22 12:46:45 UTC
Lion of Judah,



mary was Jesus earthly mother, from the blood lines outside of those cut off from the throne because of sin (if you know what i'm talking about. Joseph was of that blood line and no child of his could ever take the throne and rule Isreal.



mary is indeed blessed.



raising her beyond the status of Jesus mother does violence and perverts the Word of God, old and new testiment.



those who exalt mary beyond what she was state that she is an intercessor, queen of heaven and so forth. you know all this.



the bible does not provide for her to be anything more.



I'm not anti-mary, mom of Jesus, i'm anti-Mary theolgy, full of grace, intercessor, queen of heaven, essencial for salvation, and all the other doctrine of demons teaching that are put on this idol who opposes the Holy Just Righteous Nature and Works of JESUS CHRIST, LORD and Savior.
Catholic in the South
2008-07-22 12:08:42 UTC
No it is not cool to be anti- Mary



One of our commandments is "Honor thy Mother an Father"



As Mary is the Mother of our Lord Jesus Christ, how could you not honor her?
2008-07-22 12:12:45 UTC
hmmm...tough question. i am not an expert so i may be wrong. but i am christian, and i do not pray to mary like i pray to God. see, i believe we should respect mary. she had a lot of faith to give herself to God at probly around the age of 14 to bear the son of God. it would be like thanking your mother for dinner everynight. like, you say thanks, mom. but you dont go get down on your knees and kiss her feet and sob becuase you are so joyful you ate. not that mary doesnt deserve that. she does. i mean think about it, if she had refused what God asked of her, would God have picked someone else? when would he have? i mean we could still be waiting for Jesus to come for the first time if she hadnt
older
2008-07-22 12:14:08 UTC
doesnt sound to me like you are anti-mary---she was indeed blessed but i dont pray to or thru her but i believew she is to be honored above all women
NERO
2008-07-22 12:15:14 UTC
More like Lion of Hell, to say such blaspheme things.
?
2008-07-22 12:34:09 UTC
It is not being Anti-Mary, to add no more to what the Bible has given unto understand who Mary is and the blessed job that was given to her. and she is blessed for that reason above all woman. but to add to that is wrong, We should not become Anti- Truth. And preach the Gospel as God intended, not to please some man or pope.
Unafraid
2008-07-22 12:13:06 UTC
In my opinion that makes no logical sense. If you are Christian...why would you be anti-mary? Not all Christians are Catholic!
Jesus freak
2008-07-22 12:36:43 UTC
We souldn't pray to Mary, but we should remember that she was the mother of Jesus, you know? How would you like it if someone said something dishonorable about your mom?
Salvation Soldier
2008-07-22 12:15:49 UTC
Are you like 10 or something?
2008-07-22 12:07:45 UTC
no one is higher than Jesus..so Paul and Mary are on the same level as us.
Sarita
2008-07-22 12:24:01 UTC
We should not pray to Mary,she was only a woman God chose to have His son born as a man through. The Catholics seem to have a problem understanding the 2nd commandment, they make little statues of Mary and worship them like idols, that is a sin. You can only pray through Jesus to God not through Mary. Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth and the life, nobody comes to the Father except through me." You can not get to heaven praying to Mary, only through Jesus can you be saved.
2008-07-22 12:13:44 UTC
Wait, you'd rather worship Paul?!?!?!?!!?



For all of the wonderful things he stood for, no doubt...?
hilary k.
2008-07-22 12:08:24 UTC
not being catholic i agree with you...i think Mary was a wonderful woman who did God's will and she was blessed....but she is not in any way divine and does not need to be mentioned in prayer...in a way, that's making an idol....
2008-07-22 12:10:38 UTC
I had a friend who had mental health issues too... He got over it.

Get well soon.
Pierce
2008-07-22 12:07:40 UTC
If you believe she gave birth to your holy christ as a virgin - then without her your religion would surely have not existed??



Atheist
Cross Crafter
2008-07-22 12:11:03 UTC
Because of recent discussions about the Catholic Church's considering defining a new dogma concerning the Virgin Mary it might be of interest to Christians of other Churches to have some explanation of the Orthodox Church's position concerning her.



The Orthodox Church honors and venerates the Virgin Mary as "more honourable than the Cherubim and more glorious without compare than the Seraphim.........." Her name is mentioned in every service, and her intercession before the throne of God is asked. She is given the title of "Theotokos" (Greek for "Birth-giver-of-God), as well as "Mother of God". She has a definite role in Orthodox Christianity, and can in no way be considered an instrument which, once used, was laid aside and forgotten.



Objections to the veneration of the Theotokos are based primarily on what is called "a lack of scriptural evidence to support such a practice." While it is true that the Church depends heavily on her Tradition other than Holy Scripture (Ecumenical Councils, liturgical books, and the writings of the Fathers) for details and the precise definition of the nature of the veneration of the Virgin Mary, there are several passages of the New Testament that really form the basis for our practice.



The angel Gabriel was sent by God to announce to the Virgin the birth of the Saviour: "Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women." (Luke 1:28) This angelic salutation forms a part of the hymn of the Church most frequently sung in her honor. Could we be wrong in repeating the words of the very messenger of God? Elizabeth, the Virgin's cousin, considered it an honor for the Mother of her Lord to visit her. "And whence is this to me that the Mother of my Lord should come to me?" (Luke 1:43) Is there any real difference between saying "Mother of God" and "Mother of the Lord"? Surely, God is the Lord! (Psalm 118:27) In the course of her visit to Elizabeth, the Blessed Virgin spoke the words that form the principal hymn sung in her honor at the Matins service.





My soul doth magnify the Lord, and my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour. For He hath regarded the low estate of His handmaiden, for, behold, from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed." (Luke 1: 47-48)





Elizabeth had already been "filled with the Holy Spirit", precisely that she might cry out: "Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb." (Luke 1:41, 42) This honor given the Theotokos by her cousin is exactly what all generations of the Church do when they call her blessed. Finally, when Jesus saw His mother and the disciple John standing by the cross, He entrusted him with her care, but He also established a new spiritual relationship between them in saying to the disciple: "Behold thy Mother!" (John 19:27) What possible significance could this declaration of our Lord have except to make His Mother the Mother of all Christians? If she really had other children would she be in need of an outsider's home?



The Incarnation of God was foretold in the Old Testament. A race was chosen for a specific purpose: to produce a holy humanity from which God could take flesh. Mary is the one who, in the Lord's words, "heard the word of God and kept it." (Luke 11:28) Through her personal sinlessness she fulfilled all the hopes and prophecies of Israel. She figured greatly in the very prophecies, the most important of which is that of Isaiah: "Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Emmanuel." (Isaiah 7:14) The Church has always considered the following as prefigures or symbols of the role of the Theotokos in the Divine plan, and appoints them to be read on the eves of three of the feasts dedicated to her memory. The first is the story of Jacob's ladder, which refers to her being the means by which God chose to enter into the world physically. "He saw in his sleep a ladder standing upon the earth, and the top thereof touching heaven, the angels also of God ascending and descending by it". (Genesis 28:12) Then from the Prophecy of Ezekiel are the words concerning her perpetual virginity: "And the Lord said unto me: This gate shall be shut, it shall not be opened, and no man shall pass through it; because the Lord God of Israel hath entered in by it, and it shall be shut." (Ezekiel 44:2) The same is true of the burning bush seen by Moses: Mary contained in her womb the God-man, Jesus Christ, the God who is a consuming fire, and was not consumed.



The consequences of denying the Theotokos a part in the life of Christians are more serious than one may think in view of all its implications. Orthodox theology insists upon the two perfect natures of our Lord Jesus Christ; He was perfect God and perfect Man. The Virgin Mary communicated the humanity of the Incarnate God. The redemption of the human race was possible through the union of God and man in Christ. De-emphasis of the sinlessness of Christ's Mother, insistence upon her having other children by Joseph (which cannot be demonstrated by the New Testament), and failure to remember her part in the history of the salvation of mankind have contributed to a general misunderstanding in some churches of the Incarnation in all its fullness and power. Very closely related to the above-mentioned things is the denial of the virgin birth of Christ, a rather popular feature of present-day liberal theology. After the virgin birth, the next basic teaching under attack is the divinity of Christ, and His resurrection, and with that, the Holy Trinity Itself.



The Virgin Mary in the Orthodox view is not regarded as a mediatrix or co-redemptress. She is an intercessor for us, and the content of prayer addressed to her is a request for her intercession. The Orthodox concept of the Church is the basic reason for the invocation of the Theotokos and all the saints. The Militant Church on earth and the Victorious Church in heaven are intimately bound together in love. If it is proper for one sinner to ask another sinner to pray for him, how much more fitting it must be to ask the saints already glorified and near the throne of God to pray for us. Surely, they know something of what goes on here, for else how could there be rejoicing in heaven over the conversion of one sinner? (Luke 15:10) The saints in heaven are equals of the angels (Luke 20:36), who are used by God in the accomplishment of His purpose (Acts 12:7)



There is scriptural evidence to support the traditional Orthodox attitude toward the Virgin Mary and the saints. The other equally valid parts of Tradition also afford abundant evidence of its soundness and importance.
2008-07-22 12:10:28 UTC
All she did was give birth to Jesus according to the Bible, so I can see where you're coming from. Most saints had to actually do something to be considered holy, Mary just had a uterus and the rest took care of its self.
2008-07-22 12:07:31 UTC
You're a fool.
primary_chem
2008-07-22 12:10:04 UTC
Quit trying to live your life and make decisions based on that stupid fairytale. You're doing everyone a disservice, even Marys.
Josh K
2008-07-22 12:07:26 UTC
The brilliant thing about the human brain is that you can be anti anything you want.
vadonna
2008-07-22 12:10:01 UTC
no where in the bible does it say to pray to mary

Jesus is the only intersessor between man and the heavenly father

no mary

no saints

Jesus only!!!
2008-07-22 12:12:19 UTC
oh yes...its cool


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