Jehovah's Witnesses on what was Jesus crucified?

Question

The NWT renders the greek word 'stauros' (Strong's #4716) as 'stake'. In Homeric Greek this is correct but that died out about 400BC. The Bible is written in Koine Greek where the correct rendering of 'stauros' is 'cross'?

Thomas remarked: "If I may not see in his hands the mark of the nails [plural]" John 20:25 YLT

In the plural, does this not indicate a cross??

Answer 1

That's interesting since I have had this query too. I didn't know this was the meaning in another form of Greek. I know that we 'borrow' words in and out of other languages and dialects, so this could be a possibility that this has happened here. Another point I would consider is what you say about the nails, regardless of the shape of the object, there could still be several nails in Jesus's hands. Another thing I often wonder is whether the stake was necessarily straight, or could have been T-shaped, like the stakes we use today in gardening.



Many words in our languages today have been carried through from hundreds of years ago. English is full of words from Old Norse, Frisian, and French for example that we wouldn't realise. Traces of Homeric Greek may still exist even today in modern Greek.



We also have to take into account something that linguists call 'semantic broadening and narrowing', whereby words broaden in meaning over time and narrow also. An example would be the word 'girl', which actually used to mean any 'young person', it was then 'narrowed' to now only mean specifically a 'female youth'. Also 'gay' used to mean 'lively, merry, bright', then broadened to mean all those things as well as 'homosexual'. Nowdays it has narrowed again to mean only 'homosexual' and no one ever refers to it in the other context any more. So in this way it is possible that 'stauros' could have changed in meaning since the writing of the NT.



So it is possible that 'stauros' was carried through from Homeric Greek, I couldn't be sure without having seen it in other Koine texts which were written around the time of compiling the New Testament though, as that would give us proper evidence.



I am very wary of relying on Strong/ Young etc without having seen where they got their evidence from, being as they were not alive themselves at the time of writing the scriptures and would not be native of those ancient tongues. The only way to prove the meanings of words from ancient languages is to either compare scripture on scripture or to gather llinguistic evidence from other texts outside the bible where the same words are found. In this case, I don't think 'stauros' is found in the bible to refer to anything other than the item Jesus died on, so it would be necessary to find evidence from outside the scriptures in material that was written at the same time in order to prove the meaning of that word precisely.



For me, I am not a JW and I would just abide by Exodus 20:4 regardless of what shape it is. But should you find any more out on this, I would appreciate knowing also.



I am also very wary of JWs translation work, since when I have written to them and queried other issues, they have responded to me and even used other bible translations from other denominations as proof that they are right. Having done a fair amount of research into the translation work, I can tell you that for example, the KJV was heavily interfered with politically by the English government and many bibles are in fact affected by the indoctrination of their churches. An example of this is in my question 'Is it an idolatrous practice' directed at JWs re. headcoverings. When they replied to my letters on this subject, they in fact quoted other bibles as linguistic evidence on this, which any linguist knows is only proof that another church agrees with them, but not necessarily linguistic proof. They also stated that they would not compare scripture on scripture to gather the meanings of ancient words. I certainly feel that this was not a linguist that replied to my letter in fact, but a person from the local Kingdom Hall, on headed paper of New York.



Not an organisation to be trusted.

Answer 2

A stake or a pole.

You have a misunderstanding somewhere, because it is correct.

There is a user here at Y/A's that is an Author and a reader of Koine & Coptic Greek,

he is not a Jehovah's Witness, and he says, and explains that it is correct....

A stake, an upright pole.





Did Jesus Really Die on a Cross?

http://www.watchtower.org/e/200604a/article_01.htm



Long before the Christian era, crosses were used by the ancient Babylonians

as symbols in their worship of the fertility god Tammuz.

The use of the cross spread into Egypt, India, Syria, and China.

Then, centuries later, the Israelites adulterated their worship of Jehovah

with acts of veneration to the false god Tammuz.

The Bible refers to this form of worship as a ‘detestable thing.’—Ezekiel 8:13, 14.



The Gospel accounts of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John use the Greek word stau·ros′

when referring to the instrument of execution on which Jesus died.

(Matthew 27:40; Mark 15:30; Luke 23:26)

The word stau·ros′ refers to an upright pole, stake, or post.

The book The Non-Christian Cross, by J. D. Parsons, explains:

“There is not a single sentence in any of the numerous writings forming the New Testament,

which, in the original Greek, bears even indirect evidence to the effect that the stauros

used in the case of Jesus was other than an ordinary stauros; much less to the effect that it consisted, not of one piece of timber, but of two pieces nailed together in the form of a cross.”

Answer 3

The Greek word generally translated “cross” is stau·ros′. It basically means “an upright pale or stake.” The Companion Bible points out: “[Stau·ros′] never means two pieces of timber placed across one another at any angle . . . There is nothing in the Greek of the [New Testament] even to imply two pieces of timber.”



In several texts, Bible writers use another word for the instrument of Jesus’ death. It is the Greek word xy′lon. (Acts 5:30; 10:39; 13:29; Galatians 3:13; 1 Peter 2:24) This word simply means “timber” or “a stick, club, or tree.”



Explaining why a simple stake was often used for executions, the book Das Kreuz und die Kreuzigung (The Cross and the Crucifixion), by Hermann Fulda, states: “Trees were not everywhere available at the places chosen for public execution. So a simple beam was sunk into the ground. On this the outlaws, with hands raised upward and often also with their feet, were bound or nailed.”



The most convincing proof of all, however, comes from God’s Word. The apostle Paul says: “Christ by purchase released us from the curse of the Law by becoming a curse instead of us, because it is written: ‘Accursed is every man hanged upon a stake [“a tree,” King James Version].’” (Galatians 3:13) Here Paul quotes Deuteronomy 21:22, 23, which clearly refers to a stake, not a cross. Since such a means of execution made the person “a curse,” it would not be proper for Christians to decorate their homes with images of Christ impaled.



There is no evidence that for the first 300 years after Christ’s death, those claiming to be Christians used the cross in worship. In the fourth century, however, pagan Emperor Constantine became a convert to apostate Christianity and promoted the cross as its symbol. Whatever Constantine’s motives, the cross had nothing to do with Jesus Christ. The cross is, in fact, pagan in origin. The New Catholic Encyclopedia admits: “The cross is found in both pre-Christian and non-Christian cultures.” Various other authorities have linked the cross with nature worship and pagan sex rites.



Why, then, was this pagan symbol promoted? Apparently, to make it easier for pagans to accept “Christianity.” Nevertheless, devotion to any pagan symbol is clearly condemned by the Bible. (2 Corinthians 6:14-18) The Scriptures also forbid all forms of idolatry. (Exodus 20:4, 5; 1 Corinthians 10:14) With very good reason, therefore, true Christians do not use the cross in worship.*

Answer 4

How can Jesus have died at 400BC? BC means "before Christ" Jesus died in 33CE.... and the bible was written in Koine Greek then, so the correct meaning of the word "stauros" is as you said, a stake or upright pole.



The cross was a ancient pagan symbol that was incorporated into Christianity much later on....



See the article:

Did Jesus Really Die on a Cross?

http://www.watchtower.org/e/200604a/article_01.htm

Answer 5

We believe Jesus was impaled not crucified.



Crucify means to have died on a cross (crux) but Jesus was nailed to an upright pole or stake that the Greek scholar W. E. Vine insists that stauros′ “denotes, primarily, an upright pale or stake.



Imperial Bible-Dictionary says that the word stauros properly signified a stake, an upright pole, or piece of paling, on which anything might be hung, or which might be used in impaling a piece of ground.



There is another Greek word, xylon, that Bible writers used to describe the instrument of Jesus’ execution. A Critical Lexicon and Concordance to the English and Greek New Testament defines xy′lon as “a piece of timber, a wooden stake.” It goes on to say that like stauros′, xy′lon “was simply an upright pale or stake to which the Romans nailed those who were thus said to be crucified.”



In line with this, we note that the King James Version reads at Acts 5:30: “The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree [xylon]. Other versions, though rendering stauros′ as “cross,” also translate xylon as “tree”. At Acts 13:29, The Jerusalem Bible says of Jesus: “When they had carried out everything that scripture foretells about him they took him down from the tree [xylon] and buried him.”



The origins of the cross as symbolised in Church worship was brought around somewhere in the 3rd century. The symbol of the cross has been used in many religious pagan worship prior.



Historians and researchers have found no evidence to validate the use of the cross among the early Christians. And the veneration of images also coincide with other introductions to apostate Christianity such as the trinity doctrine and pagan influenced observances that became Christmas and Easter. The pagan Roman Emperor Constantine had huge influence on the Catholic Church and the Catholic Church clergy had great incentives with their given political power and prestige to allow for the adoption of pagan beliefs, symbolism and observances to be catered for by the Church.



The Bible in John 20:25 records the plural for nails that made the wounds in Jesus' hands but why would you reason that only one nail would of been used to nail Jesus's hands to an upright stake?



And as Lizzy above me stated that to die on the stake was a method of death caused by the nailing. The weight of the human body suspended by the arms upright over the head would put weight stress on the torso so that the diaphragm in the chest would not be able to function properly so the person would not be able to breathe sustainably. To counter this the victim would have to alleviate the torso stress by bearing his body weight on the nails in his feet. This would caused extreme suffering which is why it is known as a torture stake. Could you imagine having to bear your body weight on impaled feet for a breath. That is why the roman soldiers broke the legs of the ones alive still over a time when the suffering was to come to an end. They broke the legs of the criminals beside Jesus to end their life and they would asphyxiate because they could not support their body weight no longer. Jesus through the heavier scourging and beatings the toll on his body was too much and he expired before just as prophesied.



Nailing a victim to a cross would not of brought an end to a human being in 3 hours. Probably get sore arms and shoulders after a while. But the method of death would of been exposure, hunger or thirst. Breaking the legs of the victim would of only brought more pain suffering to him rather than a direct act to instigate a quickened death.

Answer 6

Pole Or Stake...



Check A Strong's Greek Lexicon...



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Answer 7

No, it simply indicates that it took more than one nail to secure Jesus to a upright pole or stake. One for his hands, and one for his feet.



The "cross" and others like it all originate from ancient pagan roots. For example the Egyptians used a form of cross called an ankh which they considered to be the key of life. But where did the actual "T" shape come from? The origins go back even further to ancient Babylon and Nimrod. Babylon is the source where many pagan doctrines today come from. In ancient Babylon the "T" symbol in the form of a cross was widely used by worshipers of Tammuz, a Babylonian god, as his symbol. Tammuz is the name worshipers gave to Nimrod after he died and became deified to them.



At Genesis 11:1-9 mankind was supposed to spread out and repopulate the earth after the divine flood, but Nimrod did not want to follow this command. Instead he wanted to congregate people into a large city in order to control them. He also wanted to lead a construction project in order to build a very large tower to his fame and glory. In response Jehovah God confused their languages. When the people spread throughout the earth they took with them their Nimrod worship. Over time these pagan teachings evolved into many varieties today. But all fundamentally sprang from a single source.



In contrast Jehovah's Witnesses do not teach any version of these pagan doctrines. We strictly adhere to what the bible says and try to live our lives by it. (2 Timothy 3:16,17)



http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2011170 provides a much more thorough explanation.

Answer 8

Without the use of scripture, do you understand that it is impossible to die by crucifiction? The arms out at a near 90 degree angle, would fall off before death could occur by either dehydration or starvation. The idea of dying on a STAKE, with the arms above and behind the head would lead to suffocation that would take place when the person's strength would give out.



The notion of dying on a cross was introduced to bring in pagan symbols that represented eternity.

Answer 9

In Giv'at ha Mitvar, north of Jerusalem, June 1969, some workers on a housing project unearthed the skeleton of a man named Yehohanan (John), son of Chaffol, who had been CRUCIFIED between the ages of 24-28 at about the same time as Jesus died. He was executed on a cross with a crossbeam! Copies of the articles reporting this are found on the following pages, along with reports of earlier discoveries. One report shows that a family tomb was discovered in 1945 and the ossuaries (coffins) bore the name "Jesus" in Greek and CROSSES were drawn on them! These tombs are dated no later than 50 A.D., before the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. The symbol of the cross was used to identify those who followed the 'crucified one' even at that early date.







The Greek words "STAUROS" and "XYLON" primarily mean "WOOD" or "TREE ", which only describes what the death implement was made of, not its shape. Historians tell us that BOTH the upright stake and the cross were used for execution, and that the 'cross' could be a variety of shapes.







It was the Roman custom at the time of Jesus' death to write the name and the crime for which he was being executed on a notice board and place this above him. In Jesus' case this was done in Hebrew, Greek and Latin. This would have entailed a large notice board. The Bible tells us that this notice was placed "ABOVE HIS HEAD". If Jesus' hands had been above Him the Bible would read 'above His hands'.





Iranaeus spoke of Jesus dying on across with a cross-beam. Justin in his letter to Trypho the Jew overcame Trypho's natural Jewish abhorrence to the cross by using the example found in Exodus 17:10-12 as a 'type' of the cross of Christ. Exodus tells of the time when Moses stood with his arms stretched out all day during a battle, obviously in the shape of a cross. These are only two examples of the early church writings, there are many more dated well before 200 AD, which also speak of the manner in which Jesus died.

Answer 10

root word of crucified is cross; Cross is a cross, thus the Jw stake is irrelevant and drop the NWT in the garbage. It is not a bible but a book for Jw only.



Take Up Your Cross

Mark 8:34-35 Then he called the crowd to him along with his disciples and said, "If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me. For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me and for the gospel will save it."



THE KING OF THE JEWS - how could you write this if it is a stake or a pole.

Douay-Rheims Bible

Matt 27:37 And they put over his head his cause written: THIS IS JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS.

Answer 11

Jesus died on a cross, not a stake. In particular, the non-Christian cult of the Jehovah's Witnesses teach that Jesus died on a stake, not a cross.1 It really does not matter on which one Jesus died. The issue is whether or not He shed His blood for our sins.



The Greek word used in many Bibles which is translated into "cross" is the Greek word "stauros" which means, "an upright stake, esp. a pointed one, a cross."2 If a stake were used, instead of a cross, then Jesus' hands would have been placed above His head with a nail driven through His wrists. Since the wrists would most likely overlap, only one nail is needed through both wrists. However, If a stake were used, instead of a cross, then Jesus' hands would have been placed above His head with a nail driven through His wrists. Since the wrists would most likely overlap, only one nail is needed through both wrists. However, John 20:25 says,



"The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe."



Notice the use of the word nails (plural) in reference to hands (plural). It makes far more sense to say that Jesus was crucified on a cross with outstretched hands and one nail in each hand placed above each other on a stake. That is why it says "...in his hands the print of the nails..."



Therefore, it is most logical to state that Jesus died on a cross with outstretched arms.

Answer 12

Since it was an instrument of Death and it means nothing to True Christians. The Righteous Blood of the Messiah is what is important and it is that which saves, not a piece of wood.

Answer 13

on a stick