LDS, Mormons, and others, if you claim 'polygamy was OKed in the Bible? What about Joseph Smith's bigamy?

Question

Was that OK with God too?

My thoughts on polygamy in the Bible is that
God warned Solomon well in advance to NOT practice polygamy (and other sins).The lack of a specific rebuke by God is in no way to be taken as an acceptance or condoning by Him of the behavior. (polygamy) In the process of doing all this, Solomon was utterly disobedient to the Lord.
Yes, the wives were perhaps taken care of by their husbands, and procreation was needed. But these women did not already have a husband, as with Smith's women he asked for.
But is the end God makes polygamy NOT the ideal marriage for man, and IT caused many problems for these men. Even while allowing polygamy, the Bible presents monogamy as the plan which conforms to God’s ideal for marriage.

Anyways...

What about Joseph's bigamy? Was that justified in the name of God? or polyandry Biblical? (one woman having multiple husbands) as in the wives that Joseph took that were already married to living men.)

Joseph Smith asked several of his friend for their wives and daughters.
Why would it be OK in the Bible to ask for the hand of your faithful LDS friends wife? Like Joseph did?
If they already had a good LDS man? and they were going to stay living with the original husband? and you state no procreation came form Joseph?


And the answer "they wanted to be sealed to a prophet" is not really
going to work here because the reasons that polygamy was "allowed" (not approved of) in the Bible was..
1. The wives were taken care of.
and
2. to multiply and replenish the earth (procreate)
3. in the Bible times, Unmarried women were often subjected to prostitution and slavery.
None of these reasons pertain to Smith.

He sent them home to their husbands, and the LDS church claims he did not have any kids with these wives. (sexual relations with the wives is a debatable topic)

Bigamy ok?
Thoughts? Thank You

Answer 1

1) LDS, Mormons, and others, if you claim 'polygamy was OKed in the Bible? What about Joseph Smith's bigamy?



Yes - polygyny (multiple wives) was OK'd both in the Old Testament and in the New Testament, though the Old Testament counsels against "many wives" (however many "many" is), and the New Testament makes it very clear that "the fewer the wives, the better".





2) What about Joseph Smith's bigamy?

Was that OK with God too?



No, but this is why: first, the bible plainly tells us that Christians should obey the laws of those who rule over us *unless* those laws prevent you from obeying a *command* from God. God never commands anyone in the bible to take more than one wife, so JS was disobeying the biblical command to follow the law. Second, JS brazenly lied to his congregation (it is well-documented) about his polygyny prior to announcing a new "revelation" from God that allowed his existing multiple marriage. Deception is never OK with God, and JS clearly felt either guilt or fear - initially - regarding the discovery of what he had done.





3) God warned Solomon well in advance to NOT practice polygamy (and other sins).



This is not accurate.





4) or polyandry Biblical?



No. Both Old and New Testaments clearly permit polygyny and clearly prohibit polyandry.





5) Joseph Smith asked several of his friend for their wives and daughters.

Why would it be OK in the Bible to ask for the hand of your faithful LDS friends wife?



I wasn't aware that he married or proposed to anyone's wife. That is clearly contrary to the bible but reminiscent of Waco and the "Branch Davidians". Herod was strongly condemned by John the Baptist for marrying his brother's wife, even though she was divorced from his brother!





Jim, http://www.bible-reviews.com

Answer 2

What you must realize first is that 1) marriage - specifially eternal and celestial marriage (which includes plural marriage) is an Eternal Law. It is a doctrine and principle of the gospel. and 2) that when the gospel, the full gospel, was restored, ALL doctrines and principles were restored, and that included celestial marriage - which in turn includes plural marriage. Men can still be sealed to more than one woman if the first wife has passed away... there will be plural marriages that are in effect in the Celestial Kingdom. It however is NOT a requirement nor will it ever be forced upon anyone...



Joseph actually, in the beginning, did not want to do this. The Lord chastised Him for disobeying. Whether or not he ever consumated the marriages or had children will always be up for debate because no one really knows for 100% sure except those involved and God. And really, it has no bearing on whether or not the gospel is true. IF we believe that Joseph was/is a prophet of God, we must also believe that this plural marriage was revelation and that it was to be followed.

I think it was stopped for several reasons but the main being that the Lord showed to the prophet later, what would happen IF the plural marriage continued. It clearly is not a doctrine that can be lived very well among carnal people. I think in the next life, it won't even be a big deal because we will not have negative feelings about it. It won't be the same because things like jealousy and lust will not exist.



People can assume and speculate all they want. Polygamy was practiced for a short time, not by all members, and was stopped. I think people make WAAAY to big of a deal about it. If you truly understand the gospel and the POINT of being sealed together, you would see it as a huge blessing for any involved.



If Joseph ever did anything that was not in accordance with God's will, he'll have to answer for that. Not you, not me. He wasn't perfect. But he truly was a prophet of God.

Answer 3

The main reason for polygamy was for the relief of the widow and her family to give them a lively hood. Joseph was married to Eliza R Snow and when he died see married Brigham Young she never did have children. The only way a woman can be married to more than one man is if her first husband is dead. the Bible allows that? She can only be sealed to one man. The women in these marriages were happy and loved each other. Was there jealousy I'm sure there was. The was many Widows in the Church in the early days. One thing you need to understand Joseph only did what the Lord commanded him. I doubt the is anyone that evey live that suffered more than Joseph bu he never denied the Faith there is no apology need nor will one be given.

Answer 4

The debate about sexual relations isn't that debatable. Several women swore affidavits as to having sexual relationships with Joseph Smith. LDS who deny that just need to look it up. It is in the Church Records. Fanny Alger, Smith's first known extra marital affair was kept a secret from Emma Smith. And when she did find out she threw a fit. LDS tend to put the blinders on and only accept the good, sound, watered down, reasons Joseph Smith had polygamous relationships. I grew up in the LDS church I never knew Joseph Smith had more than 1 wife. I knew Brigham Young did and it was portrayed to be a good thing. I do remember one person asking about Joseph Smith's polygamy. And the person who answered said Joseph did have women sealed to him.. But no details about the circumstances surrounding any of Joseph's wives. And that is all the LDS like to see. Nothing else though, as that is damning to the foundation of their beliefs.



Just look at the answers from LDS> They only focus on the extremely watered down version of Joseph's Polygamy. They wont even accept the testimony from Emma Smith and Martin Harris when their testimonies shed their belief system in a bad light. See answers from Alissa and Pinkadot to get an idea.

Answer 5

Either Joseph Smith Jr. is a prophet of God and was being obedient to God or he is a major fraud.



I have gained my testimony of Joseph Smith through physical and spiritual means. I know he was a prophet of God. The Book of Mormon is the greatest testament that he is a servant of God. His life is the greatest testament that he is a servant of God.



If you were to look at this one issue and leave everything else concerning his life out, including a spiritual witness, I would agree with you.



This the the important question: Was Joseph Smith a prophet of God?

I know he was.

Answer 6

Dang! I wanna' be like Phrog!



to expand on what was said about Solomon - Solomon's problem is described in scripture:

(1 Kings 11:1-8)

1 BUT king Solomon loved many strange women, together with the daughter of Pharaoh, women of the Moabites, Ammonites, Edomites, Zidonians, and Hittites;

2 Of the nations concerning which the LORD said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall not go in to them, neither shall they come in unto you: for surely they will turn away your heart after their gods: Solomon clave unto these in love...

7 Then did Solomon build an high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that is before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon.

8 And likewise did he for all his strange wives, which burnt incense and sacrificed unto their gods.





the problem is that Solomon's wives turned his heart away from God (see warning in Deut) NOTE: the problem is NOT the plurality of wives, but simply wives TAKEN WITHOUT GOD'S AUTHORITY that turn his heart away from the Lord.



Also, to offer support to Phrog's answer - I found this quote from Wilford Woodruff.

"We want the Latter-day Saints from this time to trace their genealogies as far as they can, and to be sealed to their fathers and mothers. Have children sealed to their parents, and run this chain

through as far as you can get it. When you get to the end, let the last man be adopted to Joseph Smith, who stands at the head of the dispensation.."

With their view of Joseph Smith, standing in the position as the last link of the chain, uniting all families together, it should'nt be surprising that many women were sealed to him, including women who were civilly married to other men.



EDIT: Again, I am only trying to offer support and clarification for Phrog's answer - as I agree with it completely, not a rebuttal - The edit included. You imply that polygamy was never acceptable and refer to Moses - but Moses himself may have been a polygamist - Moses married Zipporah (Exodus 2:22) and an "Ethiopian" (Cushite) woman Num. 12:1. It is withint the realm of possibility that they were the same person - but they may not have been as well. And The Law of Moses - Deut. 21:15 provides rules governing Israelites who have plural wives. Further instructions are also given in Exodus 21:10. Why did God not ban plural marriage through Moses if it is always an immoral act?



I will not try to change your opinion on what the Bible says...I can only tell you what I KNOW to be true - but if you really understand what Phrog or myself are saying - why do you keep asking the same thing? I am just going to quote Phrog's answer here, as I cannot possibly say it any better....

1. At certain times and FOR HIS SPECIFIC PURPOSES, God, through His prophets, has directed the practice of plural marriage.

2. Joseph Smith was sealed to women who had currently living husbands, but there is no evidence that this resulted in simultaneous sexual partners

3. there is some evidence that JS was married to these women 'for eternity' (as opposed to 'for time and eternity')

(my add - thereby supporting the familial sealing idea)



You seem to think, as many others do, that these sealings and "marriages" were all about sex. That is just not the case as supported by the facts. Fawn Brodie has claimed descendants from these unions - which DNA testing has now proven inaccurate. They were concerned with creating an extended family unit. It is that simple.

Answer 7

There is a difference between eternal truths, contemporary councils, practices, and customs.



Polygamy is not something that is either always practiced or never practiced. It has been practiced historically, but it it is not currently. That doesn't mean that it never will be. I don't know many Christians that paint their doorposts with blood from a sacrificed animal. That's in the Bible as well.



The question is: Are there modern prophets who share god's council with us or not. If there are, then your question is obsolete.

Answer 8

I'm exmormon and this topic is along the lines of why I left the LDS/Mormon church. I found out that JS was today's equivalent of a pedophile. He married two 14 year old girls when he was about 38 and D&C speaks about giving JS virgin wives...traditionally virgin wives is seen as well...you know what the prize is. That's when I knew that that was Joseph Smith being carnal and not following the will of God. Then I started looking into all of his wives and was shocked about him marrying married women! There is absolutely no excuse for that, especially not from a supposed "prophet of god." I know it was God who showed that information to me!

Answer 9

the bible does not forbid plural marriage.....and in fact, many biblical figures (Abraham for example) had more than one wife.

furthermore, biblical laws forbid kings from being led astray by plural spouses, or entering relationships not sanctioned by God's authority....AND provide guidelines for legitimate plural relationships. so your 'interpretation' of what the bible says is not entirely accurate - for example Solomon's wives turned his heart away from God, as deuteronomy cautioned. nothing is said against the plurality of wives, but against wives 'taken without authority' that turn his heart away from the Lord. so like the LDS have always said - it's only ok when God says so......



sealing (marriage, sealing, and adoption in fact, were nearly interchangeable concepts in the early church) creates new, eternal families, and links in the chain of families stretching back to Adam, who was linked to God.



so the 'family of God' became more than metaphor to those in the early church - it was viewed a short step from sealing existing families to extending that privilege outward....and most of the saints would have family outside the church - creating an understandable anxiety that they be included in the new, eternal family being forged by Joseph.



edit: At certain times and FOR HIS SPECIFIC PURPOSES, God, through His prophets, has directed the practice of plural marriage --- I am not privy to all the reasons God had for commanding Joseph to engage thus, but I will accept God's reasons over your suppositions and interpretations (ie:IMHO) any day of the week.....I am not willing to limit God to your opinions and interpretations - sorry.

now about polyandry as that seems to be where your focus lies - it is true that Joseph Smith was sealed to women who had currently living husbands, but there is no evidence that this resulted in simultaneous sexual partners.....and there is some evidence that JS was married to these women 'for eternity' (as opposed to 'for time and eternity' - a marriage based only in the celestial aspect of family and having nothing to do with cohabitation in this life.

and as I pointed out previously - it may have been that these sealings were along the same lines as adoptions and familial sealings rather than "marriage" sealings. the church was new and the saints were in a hurry to get things done - they did not always understand entirely what they were completing or why....they were learning. many early LDS had living parents/spouses who were not members of the church,

and so were not eligible for sealing blessings. the obvious solution for those would have been to arrange to be sealed to someone likely to attain exaltation—such as Joseph Smith.



and just as a side note - concerning Deut 17:17 -

17 Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away: neither shall he greatly multiply to himself silver and gold.

it is not necessarily warning against polygamy - as there are times when it was condoned by God and Solomon was one of those - but it is a warning not to take wives without the proper authority (God's approval) - or to seek more after riches than God.....which Solomon blows even after this warning - taking unapproved wives who turn his heart away.



edit2: @halfvast - excellent quote from WW.

Answer 10

Joesph Smith's wife was smart enough to call him on his BS.

But because she was a women (back then) it didn't matter what she said.

Well now we know better, that women are just as smart and valuable as us.

It's other women's descion to participate, if they can be fooled or if they are happy with it, the let them.

Answer 11

what about the polyandry, women already married, then married to joseph, this is polyandry...something brigham young put a stop to.

Answer 12

If God commands it then that's a good enough reason.



The question is was he really a prophet? If he was, then there you go! If he wasn't, then there you go!

Answer 13

you've been misinformed.