Question:
Religion and evolution?
Membersonly
2014-03-31 21:17:26 UTC
Is it at all possible that evolution fits within the "laws" of the bible? I've been raised in a Christian home, and my mother is a very strong believer. However, evolution is, as far as I know, a concept broadly accepted by the scientific community. I very much agree with the morality preached by Jesus Christ and I can't seem to wrap my head around how very thing on the earth just happened by chance, but due to evolution theory, I'm beginning to question the validity of the bible. Please, I would rather not have answers that insult religion or are arrogant, I would prefer open discussion, non judgemental answers. Thanks so much
23 answers:
Newms34
2014-04-01 11:08:42 UTC
Directly, yes, the bible does conflict with evolution (or vice-versa). But that's only if you read it completely literally.

I would echo what Dave Muscato says, that evolution is NOT chance. This is a MAJOR misunderstanding on your part, and not one that you can safely ignore. Here's how it actually works:

Mutations are random. The chance that you'll get a change from one nucleotide to another at point A in your genome are roughly the same* as the chance that you'll get a different mutation at point B.

But natural selection, the process that essentially says "yeh, this is a good mutation" or "eww, that's a bad mutation" is NOT random. It has predictable trends, and it follows known patterns. Furthermore, over time, small random changes, each of which is weighed against a pattern-table of what 'works' an what doesn't, build up into predictable evolutionary trends.

Don't mistake the randomness of mutations for the predictable nature of natural selection. Life on earth did not just poof into existence by chance.



There is unfortunately very little archaeological evidence of the bible being literally true**. Most of the stories are morality tales - how to treat your neighbor, how to be pious, etc. - and not meant to be read as literally having happened. The flood, for example, is simply not supported at all by the geology. We do not find uniform sediment deposits worldwide. We do not find extinctions of ALL land animals (and for that matter, marine creatures due to salinity changes) at any point in history. Furthermore, we do not have any evidence of a boat that, frankly, would probably have dwarfed a modern oil tanker if it were TRULY to bring a genetically viable sample of every animal on the planet, as well as every marine creature (since they simply would have not survived the salinity change).



*Roughly. There are SOME controlling factors, like position on the genome, environmental radiation, etc.

**The one exception seems to be Jesus. There is actually non-religious evidence of a Jewish priest around the turn of the millennium.
?
2014-04-01 05:13:01 UTC
What "laws" of the bible are you talking about?



"broadly accepted by the scientific community" - Try "universally accepted."



It didn't happen by chance. It was chemistry following the patterns (aka laws) of physics. Nothing more and nothing less. It wasn't "chance" any more than when a leaf dies and falls off a tree, it goes down and not up. Gravity says things fall downward. It's not like it's a 50/50 shot which direction it's gonna go. This is how the laws of nature work.



There is nothing special about the bible that would give its authors any special insight above and beyond what anyone else thousands of years ago knew. These are people who had not yet invented toilet paper. There is no reason whatsoever to think that they knew secrets about astrophysics or evolutionary biology. They didn't. They were writing down oral mythology, no different than Greek myths or any other myths.



We have answered these questions already. Science has explained these things. It's not a mystery. The only reason anyone even asks these questions is that religious leaders try to pretend there's some controversy. There isn't. Educated people in places like Canada and England and France and Norway and so on cannot believe that anyone in the USA actually doesn't think evolution is true. To them, that is like saying you don't think the theory of gravity or the germ theory of disease is true. The fact is, we have just as much evidence for evolution as we do for either of those theories. The only reason anyone questions evolution is because gravity doesn't disagree with what the Bible authors wrote.



Interestingly, the germ theory of disease DOES disagree with what the bible authors wrote—they said disease was caused by demon possession, but no one really believes that anymore except a few fringe religious fundamentalists. That is how the rest of the educated world sees Americans who do not understand and accept evolution. It's been shown true and it's just a matter of getting religious people to admit.



Usually this is a matter of not understanding what evolution actually is. I noticed that you said "by chance" which shows me that you do not understand it. This is not an insult and you shouldn't feel like I'm trying to make you feel ashamed or something, it's just that it seems no one has ever taught you about it.



I suggest reading the Richard Dawkins book "The Greatest Show on Earth" if you want to know why scientists in the rest of the world (Dawkins is British) are so certain evolution is true.



Hope this helps.
The Eye
2014-04-01 04:27:38 UTC
the bible says we were made about 5000 years ago, made out of dust, and that the sun was made AFTER light was made...

For a quick experimentation of how that works, pick up a box of matches and TRY striking a match without even touching a match...



Could a god have kick-started the big bang?

God(at the point of the big bang and the slow expansion of the universe's formation: "WHOA! bugger! what did I just drop!?! that was LOUD!... whoa... look at THAT! that's just BEAUTIFUL!"



COULD god have been the cause for evolution: "hmmm... I have something of a ludicrous idea... what if I influenced these tiny things at a genetic level to... well... sort of 'try'. to grow and learn on their own... I don't even KNOW what they'd do, but i'd love to find it out!"



God watching humans thrive: "pyramids! awesome! Ziggurats! cool! ...I don't even KNOW what the hell THOSE are, but... man, I am really really PROUD of these human things. they're so tenacious and driven and.... and.... WAIT A SECOND! HOLD THE PHONE! WHAT is THIS!?!"



God, upon reading the bible: "I DIDN'T SAY THAT! I NEVER DID THIS! why the hell are people using THIS piece of ancient drivel to justify being so cruel and Malicious to everyone!?!... sheesh... i mean, i'm happy that not everyone is BUYING this but... ugh, this has really upset me.... y'know what, i'm gonna just go away for a while and come back when everyone's being more sensible to each other... I mean, GEEZ! what? do people REALLY think i'd make this planet just so everyone can tell me how great I am all the time? HELL NO! that would be such a dick move!... and I'm not insecure... Okay, yeah, I gotta go before I do something moronic like flood the world with magic water that came from nowhere or something..."
Old Man Dirt
2014-04-01 10:31:08 UTC
This is the thing that bothers me- no place do I see that a Christian has to reject the entire concept of evolution. There is some truth to it, the problem is were to draw the line! This is an explosive issue and one which each of us needs make peace with.

My own personal line is that nature by itself can not account for the different species!

Mankind has been changed (according to the Bible) at least twice. It is clear reptiles as we see them now do not reflect the animals in the Garden of Eden (science will back me up on that one) and that there was a major disaster (the flood) that exterminated many species (the animals Noah brought on the Ark came to him).

What is not clear is the right translation of "Day" in the opening chapters. It could have been translated "Age" just as easily.

I have said too much and I am sure I will get labeled a heretic by some, others think I have a few screws loose already. But here is the bottom line to me-

"Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up"

Having the right answers is not as important as living the right kind of life, so we need to stress living a Christian life. I keep my mouth shut in Bible class on this subject and when in secular class at least note to my self that it is a theory or what either the teacher or text teaches. No is no reason in either situation to set ones self up for a confrontation which does no good in the end.
Arnie
2014-04-01 19:54:44 UTC
~~When asked to describe my thoughts on GOD and Religion my train of thought led me right to gravity. . .

You can’t see gravity, You can’t taste it, I just know one thing for certain, that it exists.



The mystery's of faith an GOD are beyond our ability to understand.

There is a lot we know but so much more that we don't..







How can the universe create itself out of nothingness? Given the fact that the universe began to exist, it must have had a “cause” that originated it.Doesn't it make more sense to assume the existence of a Creation. This statement is tricky because it sneaks in the false assumption that GOD came from somewhere and then asks where that might be. The answer is that the question does not even make sense. It is like asking, “What does blue smell like?” Blue is not in the category of things that have a smell, so the question itself is flawed. In the same way, GOD is not in the category of things that are created or caused. GOD is uncaused and uncreated—He simply exists.

We know that from nothing, nothing comes. So, if there were ever a time when there was absolutely nothing in existence, then nothing would have ever come into existence. But things do exist. Therefore, since there could never have been absolutely nothing, something had to have always been in existence. That ever-existing being is what we call GOD ,GOD is the un-caused Being that caused everything else to come into existence. God is the uncreated Creator who created the universe and everything in it.



The universe requires a cause because it had a beginning, GOD unlike the universe, had no beginning, so he doesn’t need a cause. Einstein’s theory of general relativity, which has much experimental support, shows that time is linked to matter and space. So time itself would have begun along with matter and space. Since GOD is the creator of the whole universe, he is the creator of time. Therefore He is not limited by the time dimension He created..
Cindy
2014-04-01 04:27:58 UTC
I am a Christian and I believe that God created via evolution. I believe this not so much because of the scientific evidence; I haven't looked at it but I feel confident it's strong enough to satisfy most rational intelligent people. Don't misunderstand though; I think it's also entirely possible to be a rational, intelligent person, and still be a YEC. It's just not possible to me.



The literal interpretation of the OT, particularly of the Pentateuch (1st 5 books) is a very recent phenomenon which came into fashion during the Protestant Reformation. The Reformers were right to disagree with the RCC on many of its teachings and policies IMO, but they were wrong to make a "god" of the bible and to insist on a literal, face-value interpretation of all scriptures. We in the USA have often grown up with such an interpretation though, and it's hard for us to understand that we can honor God's word as inspired and still read it as (in some places) largely symbolic.



To me, the symbolism is far more profound than a surface reading (which often leads to very silly -- not to mention deeply disturbing -- conclusions).



I believe in evolution primarily because it provides for me a very convincing theodicy for the Problem of Evil (PoE). But that's another story.



Yes. It is absolutely possible (and frankly easier) to be a Christian who believes in evolution.
tentofield
2014-04-01 04:27:46 UTC
There are many parts of the Bible that conflict with science but two of the major sticking points are both in Genesis - the creation myths and the story of Noah. If Noah is correct then all science is wrong. All of it. Nothing science has discovered can possibly be true if the Noah story is correct. The two creation myths in Genesis cannot be aligned with what we know of cosmology, astronomy, abiogenesis and then evolution. The Sun orbits a flat Earth if Genesis is to be believed.



Christianity is about the teachings of Christ, more specifically the teachings of Paul and does not need a literal interpretation of Genesis to exist. Those who believe the Genesis stories to be true and reject science must have a great deal of difficulty living in the 21st century where science dominates so much of our lives. If you use anything electrical then Genesis has to be wrong. You cannot reconcile Science and Genesis.
?
2014-04-01 04:31:28 UTC
I am a christian and i believe in evolution. Evolution does however disprove a literal interpretation of the bible (ie. the world being created in 7 days etc).



I consider myself a non fundamentalist christian (i dont not believe that the bible was written with the intent of being interpreted literally). I believe that most of the stories in the bible are just stories used to convey important ideas and morals.
CRR
2014-04-01 22:38:03 UTC
God created everything to reproduce after it's own kind. This does not prevent adaptation and speciation within the existing kind, and there is ample evidence for this happening. However there is very little evidence for evolution producing new kinds. This is consistent with the Bible.



Very often you will be shown an example of adaptation/speciation within the kind and be told that it is evidence for evolution when it isn't. Such as

- antibiotic or pesticide resistance

- new species such as the London Underground Mosquito

- activation of latent capabilities such as Lenski's citrate eating bacteria or adult lactose tolerance

- simple changes in predominant colour such as the Peppered Moth

- almost any change in allele frequency in populations over time
Samir
2014-04-01 04:27:21 UTC
One can argue all you want, but truth is all those books are written by humans, talk about bible, Geeta, Kuran-e-sharif. All these books represent how to live a peaceful & meaningful life.



I am atheist my self though I respect all religion & believe in non. The evolution is not a concept but a fact which is not realized few years back. It is quite a lot possible that this can be believed & felt at the time of christ.



My only problem with religion is that people use it to their benefits & bend the meaning written in those books according to they want & make other believe those things blindly.



Religion is made for human, Humans are not made for religion.
BuzzyBee
2014-04-01 05:00:27 UTC
You can make any text mean what you want if you stretch it and such...but real question is why doesn't the Bible just say that evolution is how God made all the animals we see. It doesn't say that at all because the people who wrote the Bible didn't know how animals and people came about and were making up a story of how it did happen.
?
2014-04-01 04:27:40 UTC
Well, there's a school of thought called "theistic evolution" which suggests that God created life and then put in place the mechanisms for evolution. That would fit within the "laws" of the Bible.



The problem I have with that though is that it presupposes the existence of a deity. Personally I see no point in arbitrarily inserting a supernatural step into natural processes which work just fine on their own.
Nous
2014-04-01 07:10:02 UTC
The Pope, Catholic Church, Church of England and mainstream churches all accept the big bang and evolution!



Lord Carey the former Archbishop of Canterbury put it rather well – “Creationism is the fruit of a fundamentalist approach to scripture, ignoring scholarship and critical learning, and confusing different understandings of truth”!



Nice that Christians and atheists can agree and laugh together even if it is at fundie expense!



But behind the laughter is the despair at the fundamentalists striving so hard to destroy Christianity by turning it from a religion to an ideology!



Surveys suggest that 29% of American Christians are so extremist in their beliefs that they fall well outside of the accepted bounds of Christianity!
?
2014-04-01 04:25:50 UTC
As you may be aware, Jehovah's Witnesses have published a number of articles about the theory of evolution. Some of those articles have generated questions in the minds of some readers.



Here is a couple of those questions with satisfying answers....



Evolution Some stumbling blocks to honest debate on the subject of evolution appeared in the article “Is Evolution Logical?” (June 8, 2000) You state: “Is it conceivable that the spider has evolved a manufacturing technique so complex that man has yet to understand it?” Why not? Scientists don’t have all knowledge.



C. W., Australia



The spider’s manufacture of silk involves a number of incredibly complex mechanisms that scientists still do not understand after decades of research. Yet, they dogmatically state that this is all the product of evolution. We believe that this and numerous other examples illustrate the basic illogic of evolution and suggest that belief in that theory is more akin to faith than science.—ED.



I have never read anything on one point that I have always felt argues strongly against the logic of evolution: How did our ancestors (whatever some think they were) divide and become two different sexes? Saying that this happened over millions of years hardly explains things, since a female cannot become pregnant gradually.



H. R., United States



Our reader makes a valid point, one that we commented on in our May 8, 1997, article “Is Evolution’s Foundation Missing?” We stated: “We are expected to believe that by chance evolution also produced a male and a female at the same time in order for the new species to be perpetuated. To compound the odds, we also have to believe that the male and the female not only evolved at the same time but also in the same place! No meeting, no procreation!”—ED.
2014-04-01 04:22:14 UTC
In a way. Genesis merely explain that God is the creator, but it doesn't say how he created everything. The seven days, for example, is theorized to not have a literal meaning but represent something such as billions of years, and it is likely God made his creation in a complex form, such as evolution. On top of that, the basics of evolution, such as natural selection, can be understood and witnessed in a lifetime.
Shalena C
2014-04-01 04:36:00 UTC
It is very admirable that you agree with what the Bible says. I too believe in creation. What helps me keep proving that the Bible is true is looking at the complexity of everything created. Think about our bodies for instance. They are made up of trillions of cells that restore and repair and even replace themselves without us even having to think about it. Is that not amazing! Look at the different species of animals and their unique ways. Does it make much since to believe that those things could've come about by chance? Another thing to consider is the fact that if things really did appear from evolution, would we not still be evolving today? A scripture that comes to mind is Romans 1:20, which says: "For his (God's) invisible qualities are clearly seen from the world's creation onward, because they are perceived by the things made." This verse points out that we can see God's personality and power in the things he has created. So take a moment to look at everything around you.
carterchas
2014-04-01 04:27:33 UTC
I am a Christian. I also believe in evolution and other science. There is no conflict. To people who insist there is a conflict I say this: My belief in God is about FAITH. My belief in science is about LOGIC and FACTS. Science does not comment on religion (though some scientists do). Science is about what can be tested, belief is not enough. To religious people I know I say: Do not make my FAITH contingent upon me not believing LOGIC and FACT.



I think Galileo said it best,(not perfectly quoted), "I do not believe that our God, who endowed us with brains and intelligence, did not intend us to think."
Red Dragon
2014-04-01 04:22:37 UTC
No it is not possible.Evolution gives us knowledge of the factual world where we are a branch of life emerged on this planet, while bible teaches us that this is all created for us and for our rule.
2014-04-01 04:23:10 UTC
Not necessarily. We're basically animals. Why do other animals not get salvation but we do? What makes us special?
?
2014-04-01 07:26:37 UTC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agV0FO4pN7M
2014-04-01 04:20:07 UTC
Yes.



Evolution, is in the bible.
2014-04-01 04:24:13 UTC
NO



Atheists easily disproved...dont be conned by them.

Probability and Order Versus Evolution

by Henry Morris, Ph.D.

One of the strongest direct evidences for special creation is the existence of innumerable highly complex systems in the universe, systems composed of components occurring in a pattern of "order" rather than disorder. Creationists maintain that highly ordered systems could not arise by chance, since random processes generate disorder rather than order, simplicity rather than complexity and confusion instead of "information."



For example, consider a series of ten flash cards, numbered from one to ten. If these are thoroughly and randomly mixed, and then laid out successively in a linear array along the table, it would be extremely unlikely that the numbers would fall out in order from one to ten. Actually, there are 3,628,800 different ways in which these numbers could be arranged, so that the "probability" of this particular ordered arrangement is only one in 3,628,800. (This number is "ten factorial," written as 10!, and can be calculated simply by multiplying together all the numbers from one to ten.)



It is obvious that the probability of such a numerically ordered arrangement decreases rapidly as the number of components increases. For any linear system of 100 Inanimate flash cards in specified order, the probability is one in 100!, or one chance in 10158 (a number represented by "one followed by 158 zeroes") of course, that destroys all evilution theory..its irrefutable.



A system requiring such a high degree of order could never happen by chance. This follows from the fact that probability theory only applies to systems with a finite possibility of occurring at least once in the universe, and it would be inconceivable that 10158 different trials could ever be made in our entire space-time universe.



Astro-physicists estimate that there are no more than 1080 infinitesimal "particles" in the universe, and that the age of the universe in its present form is no greater than 1018 seconds (30 billion years). Assuming each particle can participate in a thousand billion (1012) different events every second (this is beyond all reason, obviously), then the greatest number of events that could ever happen (or trials that could ever be made) in all the universe throughout its entire history is only 1080 x 1018 x 1012, or 10110 (most authorities would make this figure much lower, about 1050). Any event with a probability of less than one chance in 10110, therefore, cannot occur. Its probability becomes zero for only one protein molecule, and there are billions just to make up one DNA strand..you can easily see what a joke atheists are with their so called evilution theory.



Thus, the above-suggested ordered arrangement of 100 flashcards has a zero probability. It could never happen by chance. Since every single living cell is infinitely more complex and ordered than a bunch of flash cards, it is impossible that even the simplest form of life could ever have originated by chance. Even the simplest replicating protein molecule that could be imagined has been shown by Golay1 to have a probability of one in 10450.

There are only 10 to the 82nd power atoms in the entire universe. Numbers don't lie , atheists do.

Atheists are not sincere in their expressions. Their aim is to manipulate your mind, and undermine your faith. (Psalm 12:2 read) With good reason, the Bible then tells us to avoid Atheists, just as we would avoid a person who was infected with a deadly contagious disease. (1 John 2:18-19 read)

Because they oppose the truth, Atheists are part of the Anti-Christ. They are liars and deceivers,(Deuteronomy 32:46-47 read) They work tirelessly for satan, satan owns them.. be aware of their traps.



Like Satan, Atheists are unruly men who cook up wicked reasonings and season their brew with poisonous lies that deceive minds. Their preference is to partake of falsehood at the table of demons. Atheists are part of the seed of the serpent spoken of at Genesis 3 verse 15. They say that good is bad and that bad is good just as it was prophesied thousands of years ago at the time of the end.
Courtney
2014-04-01 04:31:32 UTC
http://m.wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2008006?q=evolution&p=par


This content was originally posted on Y! Answers, a Q&A website that shut down in 2021.
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